Vintage Citizen Case Backs & Watch Production Date


Introduction:

Over the years Citizen have changed their watch case back markings, whilst they have also used special backs on their high grade watches and certain specific models. This page attempts to show the basic types and how to interpret the information that case backs give – often crucial to determining the authenticity of the watch. I’ll cover special case backs on a separate page.

After the very early models using the ‘F’ type movement, Citizen began to develop a wider model range and towards the end of the 1940s and particularly in the 1950s a number of models were in production.  Each of these used various case designs, with different case materials, and the case back markings began to reflect this. I have identified three core formats, and I’ll show these in the following sections, along with some of the variants that can be found – one of the joys of this for the collector is the variety of case backs that occur as result.

The late 1950s also saw the introduction of serial numbers, which are very useful to us of course, because we can determine the date of production. More on that later.

Before covering the three basic designs, a word about the very early models. Little information is stamped on the back – typically it may relate only to the case back material:

I’ll provide more information on the early case backs in a ‘Featured Watch’ post on the Type F.

Acknowledgement – in order to get a uniform type of image and size, I have primarily used the Japanese Domestic Watch volumes as a source, I wish to give due acknowledgement and credit here.

Early Case Backs:

This section relates to watches made from around 1950 to the early 1960s. During that period Citizen’s watch production accelerated enormously, particularly with the success in the domestic Japanese market of the ‘Deluxe’ hand winder. An ever wider range of hand winding watches was produced, and in 1958 Citizen launched their first automatic, soon followed by the ‘Jet’ rotored automatics of the early 1960s. Not all watches had a serial number at this time, although sometimes they may be found stamped inside the case back.

Typically the early watches use snap / press on case backs, and case type markings therefore make their appearance on the ‘transitional’ and later formats.

And not all case backs carried all the markings – some were minimally stamped and very simple whilst some were decorated, often with scrolled engraved lines. After looking at a fully marked example, I’ll show some of the variations. Here’s an example from 1963, which carries all the information to be found at that time except water resistance – see the labels for their meaning:

Notes:

1) ‘STAR’ – as far as I know this the mark of Citizen’s own case factory. It is found on watches from the 1940s through to the late 1960s.

2) ‘CGP’ – this is the Case Material Code – often this is an abbreviation, and is usually self-explanatory as in this example (Citizen Gold Plate). Some gold plated and especially gold filled watches specified the thickness of the gold, in microns. Gold filled watches were also marked to show the quality of the gold used, e.g ’14K’

3) ‘Stainless Back’ – the case back material is often stamped, particularly when the case is of a different material.

4) General & Specific Model Names – in this example the general model range is Homer, which is gleaned from the movement name. This watch has a day window only, and is therefore known as a Homer ‘Weekly’. Other models also use the Homer movement, so will carry their own model name, e.g. ‘Newmaster’. Model names on the case back are more common in the early models than later pieces.

5) Model ‘Number’ – this early type of model designation which included letters  and numbers (straightforward in this example) was changed in the late 1960s to a two part numerical format, i.e. 12-3456

6) Serial Number – by 1963 the use of this type of serial number was well established – see later on in the page for information on serial numbers and production dates.

7) This example has no indication of water resistance – watches were increasingly marked ‘Parawater’ after 1958 when Citizen designed water proof cases for the first time. ‘Parawater’ continued until the early 1970s when it was replaced by ‘Water Resistant’.

Variants on this format often have less information than the above illustration. First are two Center Second models from the 1950s, one with an early ‘Everbright’ back – this may be an alloy back rather than stainless steel – and one showing a 40 micron 14K gold filled case, with  number only model designation (NB: center second models used that name on the dial, but other models like the Master and Junior also had center second case backs like these):

 

Here’s an Ace Date with serial number, and a fully marked Alarm Date with decorative scrolling- note that this one also shows water resistance – ‘Parawater’:

 

This earlier alarm (left) has a ‘cricket’ type back (double skin with holes to help project the sound) whilst the first automatic from 1958 uses ‘water protected’ rather  than ‘Parawater’. This has a screw on type back indicated by the indentations to locate a removal tool:

 

Transitional Case Backs:

I’ve called the next format ‘transitional’ because they use the layout of the later case backs whilst retaining the earlier model designations. More and more watches were using screw on backs and less were using the snap on type more typical of the early model ranges. Case design was also developing and other case types were emerging. Here is an example of a fully marked ‘transitional’ screw on back:

Notes:

1) The back now has a circular outer ‘track’, with markings stamped around it and other information in the centre

2) The Model Number, or designation, is in the same style as the early format, usually a mix of letter and numbers

Here are some permutations – the Autodater 7 appears to be etched rather than stamped, and (unusually) has no serial number, whilst on the Crystal 7 the model symbol fills the centre:

 

These original illustrations are from a 1960s technical manual – the first shows the case type as ‘GN’ with different layouts:

And here are the same with ‘OR’ designations – the same type of cases, so ‘OR’ means the same as ‘GN’ as far as I know but is less commonly seen:

Note also that two case backs (see the two on the right in the above image) are marked with an encircled ‘x’. This means these cases are one piece that have to be opened through the glass, as on this Seven:

Later Case Backs:

The end of the 1960s saw the introduction of case numbers, distinct from the earlier combined model designation. Case numbers always start with the number ‘4’, followed by a dash and six other numbers i.e 4-123456. With the new case number system, a new model number format was also instigated: 12-3456.

The case number is often more useful than the model number, since it usually includes a reference to the movement in the watch. So for example, case number 4-520343 tells us that a movement from the ’52’ family is used.

Model names are not often seen on the back, but some now indicate the movement to be found inside – this is very helpful of course!

Here’s a typical example of a fully marked back:

Notes:

1) I have not been able to determine the system, if any, for model numbers – they generally do not help to identify the movement used.

2) In the above example you can see how the case number relates very clearly to the movement (7200)

3) ‘STAR’ has now been dropped, and the manufacturer’s name is more prominent. Later watches have ‘Citizen Watch Co’ rather than just ‘Citizen’

As ever, there are variations on this theme – some models,  I think only in the Seven Star range, have a ‘horseshoe’ track rather than a full circle, and some backs have no model information – the X8 Cosmotron on the right is marked ‘transistorized’ reflecting the application of new technology, but is not marked ‘parawater’ or ‘water resistant’:

 

Some backs are simpler, with no outer ‘track’ – the Cosmotron on the right below also has a different type of case / model combined number which uses the full movement designation as its first part; it’s also now marked ‘water resistant’ and ‘electronic’ rather than transistorized’:

 

The Seven Star on the left below has the case number in the outer track, echoing the ‘transitional’ format, and on the right a black coated Custom V2 also has a coated back (others had stainless steel backs):

 

Serial Numbers and Production Dates:

Dating a vintage Citizen watch is relatively straightforward when it has a serial number on the case back. The key is knowing which decade the watch was produced in, and the Movement Table is useful for determining that.

The first three numbers in the serial are used for the date – the first number is the year. So, using the Seven Star pictured above left as an example, with a serial number of 90203597, the first number of the serial is ‘9‘ indicates the year.  But which decade is it from?

The ‘Parawater’ designation means that the watch was not produced later than about 1973.  The case number – 4-520068 – is in the later format, and the ’52’ movements were first made in 1965 so the watch cannot be earlier than the late 1960s. We can safely conclude from this that the watch was made in 1969.

The month is easier since Citizen used the second and third numbers in the serial to represent the month – 02  on this one means production in February.

Hopefully the information to be found on this blog will allow accurate dating of watches, but please ask if you want to check anything out, especially if your watch has no serial number or was produced across more than one decade.

408 Responses to Vintage Citizen Case Backs & Watch Production Date

  1. Great work Stephen. Thanks a lot for this fantastic resource

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks Reto 🙂

      • mandy says:

        Hey would you be able to give me any info on this watch
        Citizen
        G.P
        G607
        8011445
        I would be gratefull is i could just let my granny know plz
        Thank u so much

    • ross says:

      hi there i have been given a cutlass 17 jewels parashock from my father on the back it says csp cutlass 4-020294-k under that it has 010001592 in smaller writing and under that it has63-5618. the face says cutlass 17 jewels parashock. japan 6025943y. the watch is a wind up and is in working order ,i cant find any info about the watch,would you know anything about it.the watch doesnt say citizen on it anywhere.thanks

      • sweephand says:

        Hi Ross, thanks for visiting my blog. The case number (4-020294) indicates that yours has a ‘Homer’ movement in it, which is confirmed by it being a hand winder. I presume it has a plain dial, with no date window? With that type of case number and model number (63-5618) combined with ‘parashock’ I’d guess it’s from October 1970 (from first three numbers in the serial # – 010001592). Is the dial marked ‘Citizen’ as well as Cutlass – or just Cutlass? I ask because the Citizen Cutlass of the late 1960s is a mid to high grade automatic. I’d be interested to see a pic of yours if that’s possible,

        Stephen

        • R.pedley says:

          Thank you for the information on the watch,i have attached a couple of pics,i plan on getting the watch cleaned up and get a new strap,do u know what kind of strap would have been on it and where i could purchase one,i was hoping to get the watch back to its original form.thank u again for taking the time to reply to me.Ross 

          Sent from Samsung Mobile

          • sweephand says:

            Hi Ross – unfortunately you can’t post pics directly. If you can upload them to somewhere like photobucket you can post a link. Failing that I can e-mail you and you can send them to me – let me know if you want me to do that.

            Stephen

        • Mike Kennedy says:

          Stephen, great resource you have here! I normally collect Movados, travel watches, and art deco stuff. But I saw this art deco looking watch on eBay that was the oldest Citzen wire lug watch I ever saw and no one was bidding. So I thought you might get a treat out of seeing the restorable antique. Got it for a low price. Movement clean and I had it running and purring along in 10 minutes. Pics show dial discolored, crystal missing but everything else is nice. Movement is blank other than a 42 stamped adjacent to the balance bridge on a tongue right before the escapement. Strange pinkish balance wheel jewel, no jewels on other gears, and jewels on double roller pallets are jet black. Back of case stamped from top to bottom with the following 4 designators : M (inside square), STAR (inside square), 27286, EVERBRIGHT BACK. Nice old leather band with buckle strap for the wire lugs.

          Pics:




          You might want to see the movement naturally, but the guy selling it didn’t bother to open it and take a pic. Hahaha!

          I have no idea. M for Military? 42 for manufacture date? Seller found it in an estate in Kentucky.

          • sweephand says:

            Hi Mike, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments. I’m pretty sure that your watch has the initial ‘F-type’ movement, which was Citizen’s first wrist watch movement launched in 1931. Does the movement look like this:

            The design was soon updated so I think it was probably made no later than 1935 or thereabouts. The style of the dial, with the red 24 hour numerals is suggestive of a military watch – ‘STAR’ is the case factory name and along with ‘EVERBRIGHT BACK’ is typically found on these early watches. I’ve not seen ‘M’ before so this is possibly a ‘military’ reference. Serial numbers were not used on these, so along with ‘M’ I’m thinking 27286 may be a military issue number.

            Here is a little more information on the F-type movement: https://sweep-hand.org/2013/05/07/citizens-first-wrist-watch-movement/

            Stephen

            • Mike Kennedy says:

              Stephen, thank you very much for looking at this. Yes, it is a type F, although the one you pictured was a tiny bit different. Mine has black pallet jewels and that “42” stamped on the base between the balance wheel and main bridge. When I get it cleaned up and restored, I’ll send you pictures of the movement. As for military issue, it is still a bit of a mystery, but looking in other places found a little more evidence. While Seikosha was supplier to the Imperial Japanese Army and Navy in WWII, in prewar (to us) Japan in the 1930s, Japan had a huge army in Manchuria, the Kwantung Army. Conflicts with the Chinese and Soviets. They appeared to have both Seikosha and Citizen pocket watches. Maybe the same with the early wristwatches.
              The pictures of Japanese Army with wristwatches from the 30s and 40s I found show only Seikoshas if the detail is fine enough to make out whose watch it is…but they had the same leather strap design. Wide horsehide, with a separate smaller buckled strap to hold the wristwatch. And the dials of many show a 24 hour clock, “military time”, as many of the Swiss made watches issued to the military also did.
              I found an article, no doubt one you have already seen, on the early development of Citizen watches, including the Model F, which they say was a copy of a Mido movement and it’s production period.

              http://www.watch-around.com/en/subscribers-zone/magazine/article/the-swiss-origins-of-citizen-watch.html

              I hope there is something in this or my original post that you or followers of your blog found interesting or enjoyable. My guess is that this Citizen watch will be very appreciated by a Japanese military watch collector which I am not (Though I love the history of some things), and possibly the finely preserved strap will be a collector’s joy as well.. And it’s fun to speculate on how it ended up almost unused to judge from the strap and no wear on the case, and if it is a war souvenir of some now departed soldier…Dial may just have been oxidized and dirtied up exposed when the crystal broke..

              • sweephand says:

                Hi Mike – thank you for your contribution, it’s very much appreciated. There’s very little, if any, information about vintage citizens let alone the very early ones, so it’s interesting to try and find out for ourselves! I suspect the knowledge of the military models is most likely confined to Japanese collectors. I do know the Donze article which sheds some light on Citizen’s early production and how Swiss know-how was used. I don’t know if you’ve seen my page on Citizen’s first auto, but my research on that led to some intriguing findings: https://sweep-hand.org/the-citizen-auto-1958/

                Stephen

        • ghostthug ali says:

          Hi stephen my names ali I was going threw my late grandads things and come a across a citizen watch ,I was wondering if you could tell me how old it is or if ìts important enough to keep its a citizen 17 jewels watch on bottom its says waterprotected , unbreakable spring, parashock and on the back its got written g.p CITIZEN 4-0200073 c water protected 01200966 and 63-5545 on the bottom. I would be helpful if you could help me and tell me something about its history and if I should get it appraised and valued?

          • sweephand says:

            Thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for my slow reply. Your watch is an export version of the ‘Homer’, which uses the 02 movement first made in 1962. The use of ‘water protected’ etc., and no model name on the dial indicates it was made for export rather than the Japanese domestic market. The 02 movement is also indicated by the case number – 4-0200073 – and the ’63 model number is also typical of these models. the first three figures in the serial number (01200966) tell us it was made in January 1970. More info on the Homer / 02 movement here: https://sweep-hand.org/2012/02/23/this-weeks-featured-watch-23-the-homer/

            I’m afraid these models are not great value – they are good quality and reliable movements, but they are not ‘high end’ so they are not as sought after as other models might be. Stephen

    • Predrag says:

      The marks on back case: 4-810040 Y / 00922019 / 60-3031. Any information about this Citizen Cosmotron? Thaks

  2. David Stewart says:

    Hi Stephen, The Star Watch Case company was an american company , which survived up until the late 70’s so I wonder if they were supplying Citizen then ?.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi David – this is an interesting point; why ‘STAR’ was used on the cases puzzled me for quite a while. I emailed Citizen Japan about this, but got no response at all….However, after more research I found a reference that may explain this. Although first I should also say that I looked at whether the American ‘Star Watch Case Company’ might have supplied Citizen – I can find absolutely no reference to a contract of this kind anywhere, and I’m sure there would be if it had taken place.

      But I have found a reference to a company called ‘Star Shokai’, which was originally set up in Japan to import Swiss Mido watches. Citizen took over this company in 1932. And before that time, in the early 1900s, there was a history of cases being made in Japan into Swiss movements were fitted. So my conclusion is that it’s most likely the ‘STAR’ related to this and the development of Citizen as a company when a number of business interests merged to create it in the first place.

      Addendum: After writing this I did a bit more searching in my reference stuff and found this statement in a summary history of the Citizen Watch Co.: 1932 Citizen merges with the watch case factory Star Shokai

      Stephen

  3. George Logan says:

    I have a watch that I cannot find on your site. The back is similar in some respects, but different from any that I can find.
    It has 18K GP on the side of the case behind a band pin, and on the Back, it says Star, Citizen Auto Dater, CGP, Para Water,
    The front reads in Spanish, with Citizen Auto Dater, 25, 7 and Para Water
    The case number is ADSG 51302-SA and the serial # is 6110093
    It is a self winding watch and the width of the crystal is 1 1/4 inches.
    Can you please tell me what I have? It is obviously used, but I really like the look and feel of it.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi George, thanks for visiting my blog. The case back page is a guide to understanding and interpreting the marks typically found on vintage case backs, so looking for ‘similar’ is a good starting point since it’s not possible to show all the permutations and models. Yours has what I call the ‘transitional’ type of case back, using the earlier style of model designation – ADSG 51302. This doesn’t indicate the movement used in the watch, unlike many of the later style backs. The letters are an abbreviated description though which is quite helpful – AD = Autodater, S = Seven (I think), and G = gold for the type of case finish. One of the case backs I show has a similar model designation – ADSS 51307. Since this one has a steel case it is ADSS rather than ADSG:

      This code tells me that your watch is on of the Autodater Seven range – these used the 4101 ‘Jet’ movement, the second and last of its type as Citizen moved to more conventional swinging weight rotors. I have an example using the same 25 jewel movement as yours, see here:

      https://sweep-hand.org/2013/03/26/this-weeks-featured-watch-48-jet-auto-dater-seven-25-jewels/

      The November 1966 production date your serial number gives is spot on for this model – they were first made in 1964 and were produced for a couple of years.

      Once you’ve had a look at my example, it would be good if you could let me know what, if any, differences there are between it and yours. It’s always helpful to compare and note different permutations. For example yours may have been made for export since it has a Spanish day wheel so there may be differences from those made for the Japanese domestic market.

      Photos are always good of course 🙂 If you have any you would be happy to share you can post a link here (you can;’t post an image directly though), or I can email you so you can send them to me to post if you prefer – just let me know here.

      Stephen

      • George Logan says:

        I will be glad to take some photos and send them to you, so please email me. I hope that I can get photos as good as yours.
        George

  4. sweephand says:

    thanks for the photos George – I’ll upload ’em tomorrow

    Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      Here is the back of George’s watch – it is of the ‘transitional’ type, with the early type of case model ‘number’, but the layout is a little different within the circular ‘track’:

      Given this has a Spanish day wheel, and the dial isn’t marked ’40m’, and the back is a little different I reckon this is an export model. Here’s the dial:

      Nice photos George, thanks again 🙂

      Stephen

      • Helen Bailey says:

        I have a watch that was given to me that looks like this one. The day that is showing now is Mier. The front & back is identical to this one. The back of the watch says S.S. and across to the other side says STAR. It also says ADSS 51302-Y under that is 6120231
        Citizen auto dater para water with a 7 in the center like the one above.
        It is in great working order. It winds up for power. I haven’t any clue what it is, it’s value. Other than a few surface scratches the face is in great condition. It appears to have the original watch band. I took it in to a vintage watch and jewelry dealer and they had no clue what this was. They couldn’t find it in their “book”. Any information you are wiling to share is greatly appreciated. Where would I take it to be appraised? Is it worth getting appraised?
        Thank you

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Helen, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 Great to hear that you have an Auto Dater 7 – these were made in the mid 1960s. The serial number on yours (6120231) gives a production date of December 1966. ‘STAR’ refers to the factory where the case was made, and ‘ADSS 51302-Y’ is the model name and number – ADSS = Auto Dater Seven Steel whilst 51302 is the case number which a watch maker would use when servicing the watch / replacing parts. The older Citizen mechanical watches are not that well known, outside Japan at least, and there are relatively few collectors of them. The lack of information about them led me to do a lot of research myself and then start this blog, since it was very hard to find information. So I suppose it’s not that surprising that the dealer you went to didn’t know about it. Your watch should have a ‘Jet’ automatic movement inside, which Citizen used in the early to mid 1960s. More info can be found here, where you can see the Auto Dater 7 models listed: https://sweep-hand.org/the-jet-automatic/

          I’m afraid I avoid giving my opinion on value, since many factors affect it. Generally speaking, although not of great value, a vintage Auto Dater Seven in good condition and working correctly, especially in stainless steel (which generally is preferred to gold plate), will be of interest if offered for sale on eBay for example. If you are thinking of selling that way then good photos and a full description will help and it might come to the attention of collectors who do know about these watches. For an idea of what it might sell for, try a search in eBay of ‘vintage citizen auto dater seven’ – if you include ‘completed listings’ in an advanced search you should find a few examples that are similar to yours.

          Stephen

  5. ross says:

    Hi there,that would be fine for you to email me and i will send those pics.thanks

  6. Elmo says:

    Hi Stephen, hope you can help me determine the manufacture date of this watch. This is a hand me down from my deceased grandfather. Ive attached pictures below for reference. Appreciate any help from you. Cheers!


    • sweephand says:

      Hi Elmo, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m less familiar with the later quartz models than with Citizen’s vintage mechanical watches. There have been so many quartz watches made that it is difficult to find information about them and when they were made. My best guess, after a bit of research, is that yours – with the 6031 movement – is from the the late 1980s. The serial number gives us a likely production date of March 1989. Do you think that would fit with when your grandfather may have bought the watch?

      Here’s a link to the relevant technical manual: http://www.watchuseek.com/archive/seikocitizen/Citizen_Technical_Manuals/6031.pdf

      Stephen

  7. Elmo says:

    Hi Stephen, appreciate your help. Was very helpful as it made my mom remember when and where it was bought. Thank you and more power!

  8. I have a citizen watch with this on the back:

    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    BASE METAL YP
    6031-075609 M
    11200528
    GN-4W-S
    => S

    (That last line is an arrow pointing right toward the letter S)
    Don’t know anything about this but see that you do. Whatever you can tell me about this watch will be apprieciated.

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks for visiting my blog. Apologies for my late reply. I’m afraid I’m not so familiar with the more recent quartz models so I can’t tell you a great deal about your watch. I would think it was made in the 1990s, and the serial number indicates December 1991. I doubt it would be as recent as 2001. Here’s a link to the technical manual for the watch: http://www.watchuseek.com/archive/seikocitizen/Citizen_Technical_Manuals/6031.pdf

      Stephen

      • Mary Lewis says:

        Could you help me find out how much my watch is worth? I got it as a gift for graduation from nursing school in 1980’S back says citizen 2030-941021smw. 4018151. 31-8881 or tell me how to find it? I have worn it since it was given to me. Thanks!! Mary

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Mary, thanks for visiting my blog and apologies for my slow reply. I’m afraid I don’t know the quartz models very well, but in general terms quartz do not have great value. To get an idea, I would advise searching eBay for sales of Citizen 2030 watches. Stephen

  9. Thanks for your input. I am completely clueless as to even what “Base Metal YP” means, so having info on the watch is helpful. I was pretty sure it was not an old watch, but did not know about what the metals were used in its manufacture (as it LOOKS like gold on the outside). : )
    I will certainly look at the manual!

  10. Also wanted to make the call as to whether to take it in for repairs as it doesn’t run, and didn’t want to spend a lot on a watch with no value whatsoever. Not sure from your reply or the manual what this watch might be worth, but am guessing a battery powered quartz watch from the 90s probably isn’t a great find. Again, thanks!

    • sweephand says:

      Sorry I should have said in my first reply that ‘Base Metal YP’ means that the case is made of an alloy that is then plated. YP means yellow plate which is gold coloured, sometimes called ‘gold tone’. I’m afraid it will not be of any great value.
      Stephen

      • Joe Seet says:

        Dear Stephen,

        Great information on the casing. I am seeking your help to identify my watch. I recently possessed a boy or lady size citizen alarm watch with an interesting blue rotating bezel. On the case, it has the transitional markings. At the centre, it is stated “Citizen Alarm” 81001832. Can you determine the year of production? Many thanks in advance

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Joe, thanks for visiting my blog, and glad that you have found the information here useful. The alarm model you have is rather nice and not often seen – from the first three digits of the serial number we get a production date of October 1968. Is it a plain dial (i.e. no date window) and 17 jewels? Some of these smaller models have ‘Lady Alarm’ or ‘College Alarm’ on the dial indicating the target market. Here are three examples from internet auctions, (credit for pics to the sellers):


          Stephen

          • Joe Seet says:

            Hi Stephen,
            Thanks for the quick response. You are correct. The dial is plain without date window, label as “lady alarm” at top and “17 Citizen” at bottom. Exactly the same watch per your second picture except mine is a black dial. Are such watches common? How are they compare to the later alarm date model?
            Again, thanks for sharing. Appreciated

            • sweephand says:

              Hi Joe – you’re welcome 🙂 These are pretty rare, I’ve only seen a few for sale. There is a man’s diver style alarm with date that’s also rare and sought after. A lot of collectors go for divers, even when the last thing you’d do with them is dive! Gents watches are collected far more, but the Lady Alarm will attract interest. The white dialled one (in my previous comment) recently sold on eBay for about USD220 I think. The movement in yours and the alarm date are the same as far as I know, just the date mechanism added and the date models always have 21 jewels. Yours is the 9800 movement, first produced in 1958, whilst the date version is the 3100 launched in 1964. The movement is actually a Swiss design, and after Citizen finished with it, it was taken up by Poljot (a Russian manufacturer)in the 1980s.
              Stephen

              • Seetthiamhuat says:

                Hi Stephen, Need you help again. I recently found a Citizen Quartz Alarm watch but I am not familiar with the model. Will like to tap into your knowledge and vast experiences for opinions. Grateful if you can assist. Many thanks in advance

                Sent from my iPhone

  11. hi I have my late granddads parawater automatic s.s.gn.3.s watch 4-52013174
    90704270
    on the face it says citizen seven star deluxe 7 25 jewels and has a day window and also another small window that says either ons or dns could you please tell me were and when it was made if possible he was in the merchant navy and I would love to find out a bit more about it
    many thanks
    vickie

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Vickie, thanks for visiting my blog. Good to hear you have your grand father’s watch 🙂 I’ve got a couple of questions from the info you’ve given to try and clarify which model it is – first the case number should be a ‘4’ followed by 6 other numbers and then maybe a letter or two, so do you think yours could be 4-520131 TA? Second, is it definitely 25 jewels? I’m a bit puzzled since at the moment the info from the case back doesn’t seem to fit what is on the dial, although I’m always learning new things about vintage Citizens! Do you have any photos of the watch? If so you can’t post them here directly unfortunately but you could post a link to somewhere like Photobucket, or I can email you and you can send them to me (no need to post your email address since I can see addresses when a comment is posted).

      Is the ‘day’ window showing the date? If so the other one with three letters will show the day of the week – not sure what language it is though.

      One more question I’m afraid (sorry for all the questions!) – can you see a small set of numbers at the bottom of the dial, under or at the side of the 6 o’clock marker? You may need a magnifier to read it, but this is the dial code which can be very helpful in identifying a watch.

      Stephen

  12. Mark Slocum says:

    Hello. I am trying to find out about a watch I found. On the case it says;

    Citizen Watch Co
    water resist
    st steel
    4-S80971 hse
    960404
    gn-4w-s
    japan

    I would appreciate any information you can provide.

    Thanks

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mark, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 The case number (4-S80971) with ‘S’ in it suggests to me that it might be more recent than the vintage watches I’m more familiar with. I can’t determine the movement from this information Can you please tell me what is on the dial, and particularly if there is a dial code that you can read – this will be a small number near the 6 o’clock marker – you may need a magnifier to read it though!

      Stephen

  13. Hi! Happy to have discovered this website.
    I’m trying to identify this watch, i found it in my father collection. Serial number is 6031-S13572-SMW And 9104636. It says Citizen Quartz and there is another serial on the front case, take a look here https://www.flickr.com/photos/anthonyborriello/14336201066/
    Hope you’ll like the shots too 😀
    Cheers from Italy

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Antonio, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 First of all thanks for the link to your pics, they are excellent. I’m less familiar with the later quartz models than with Citizen’s vintage mechanical watches. There have been so many quartz watches made that it is difficult to find information about them and when they were made. I have had a couple of other people ask about watches with the 6031 movement and after a bit of research I would think it was produced in the late 1980s. The serial number of yours gives us a likely production date of October 1989. The model number is 6031-S13572, and the ‘>5’ marking indicates where the back should be levered off (i.e. the 5 o’clock position). ‘YP’ is ‘yellow plate’, so the watch is gold tone, over a base metal case.

      Here’s a link to the relevant technical manual: http://www.watchuseek.com/archive/seikocitizen/Citizen_Technical_Manuals/6031.pdf

      Stephen

  14. Mike Breed says:

    Stephen:
    Like everyone else I’m trying to track down information on my Citizen. From the watch case it says:
    Citizen Watch Co.
    Base Metal YP
    4031-490321TA
    5030622 – (Serial # I assume)
    38-0261
    Japan > 12

    However on the face it says something different. Up top it says:
    Citizen
    Quartz
    On the bottom of the face it says:
    Japan 4031 492452-Y
    What does your Ouija board say about this model? Glad to send pics if you desire.

    Thanx for the info in advance!!!

    mb

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mike, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m not too familiar with Citizen’s quartz models I’m afraid, but I reckon that the dial code and the model number are consistent with each other since both start with movement number – 4031. The rest of the dial code is the dial part number so it will differ from the number on the back of the case. It’s age is harder to determine since I don’t know when this movement was in production. It could be as early as March 1985 (from the first three digits in the serial number – 503) or, and maybe more likely, it’s from 1995. The >12 mark tells you where the notch is in the case back to lever it off (i.e. the 12 o’clock position).

      I believe the compact design of the movement allowed it to be used in both men’s and women’s watches. Here’s a link to the relevant technical manual – unfortunately Citizen don’t date their manuals: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/4031.pdf

      Stephen

      • Mike Breed says:

        Thanx for being so quick to respond Stephen!! I’d say March of 1995 is dead on. It was a present from my girls and that’s the right time frame. Even tho you’re not as familiar with this style as much as others, would you have any idea of its value?

        I appreciate you getting back to me and I’ll keep an eye out for a response. Thanx again!!

        mb

        • sweephand says:

          I’m afraid quartz models do not have any great value, unless they are high end, very accurate movements, and / or are very rare early pieces. If you search eBay for something like ‘Citizen 4031 quartz’ (include ‘completed’ listings)you should find some examples to give an idea.

          Stephen

  15. Paolo Cicarolo says:

    I recently discovered a ladies watch that I have tried with much difficulty to identify its history. The watch is also in pretty bad shape so I hope to know more about it to see if it is worth repairing or even possible to repair.

    The case back says CITIZEN WATCH CO, with a case number “4-163401” and a model number that says “75-2363”. The serial number is 7-digit, starting with “810”.

    The watch is hand wound. It runs all over the place and has no functionality whatsoever in telling time, the glass is severely scratched and foggy so I’m hoping to find the parts online to get it repaired due to sentimental value. Thank you very much.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Paolo, thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for a slow reply – I have been away on a family holiday. At the moment I am also not able to find information on the model you have. One thing that can help is a dial code – this is printed at the bottom of the dial under, or at the side of, the 6 o’clock marker. I appreciate that it may be difficult to see it if the crystal is foggy, but if you can see it please let me know since it may help identify the movement.

      Stephen

      • Paolo says:

        Thanks Steph.

        But after carefully inspecting the watch, I don’t see any code or even room for any code on the dial near six o’clock or anywhere else. The watch is a ladies watch, more decorative tha practical, so the dial is pretty minimal with big Roman numerals and the word Citizen. There is nothing else on the dial. I cannot rule out that dial might have been repainted decades ago but skeptical because I doubt it would have worth the time and effort when the rest of the watch is in such mediocre shape.

        The watch is a rectangular black dial watch with a gold plated case, hand wound, the case back says

        CITIZEN
        WATCH CO.
        BASE METAL TOP
        ST STEEL BACK
        4-163401 SMW
        8105611
        75-2363
        JAPAN GP

        There are little else information I can see on the watch. There are clearly no power reserve indicator but each winding lasts around 28 hours. There is absolutely no indication of even the most elementary shock proof or water proof function in any wording whatsoever. The glass is also quite soft and has quite a few a scratches and dents, seems slightly softer than ordinary mineral glass.

        I would like to get the watch properly serviced and relubricated by independent watch repairer, but I am really afraid the thing would break down once someone has opened the case back due to the poor thing’s age and I wouldn’t be able to find the parts to keep it alive because it is a Citizen. It still keeps relatively accurate time. Have you got any advice on how to keep it alive as long as possible, especially for people like me who thinks it makes no sense to leave a watch sits unwound in a cupboard. Thanks.

      • Paolo Cicarolo says:

        Thanks Steph but nope, quite certain there is no number on the dial. It’s a ladies watch though, so the dial is pretty minimal with only Roman numerals and the word Citizen. I’ve managed to get around 27 hours per winding. There’s really no other information I can find on the watch.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Paolo, thanks for all the information, but I’m struggling to find any info on your watch. This is partly due to the fact that women’s watches are not collected so there is little or no reference material on them – that also means that there is very little value in women’s models. The only other way that we can find out what movement is used is to remove the case back – if you can do this then there should be a movement number stamped near the balance wheel, although a magnifier would be needed. Is is a screw down back or a press fit?

          Stephen

  16. Joe Seet says:

    Thanks Stephen. No worries, I may purchase the watch as I like alarm. This quartz alarm model seems to be uncommon and it makes my collection more interesting. Thanks again

  17. Janice Irvine says:

    Hi I have a watch that was found in the 70s by a family member. A old watch maker told him it was a adec but could’nt give him any information on what year it was made. On the back it has the words Water resistant. Dust Proof. Anti-Magnetic.

  18. Brian says:

    Hi Stephen,
    Great blog! I’m hoping you can point me in he right direction. I was at a local thrift shop and found this really nice Citizen automatic in lovely condition…other than the crystal. Any chance there is a source for a replacement? case number 4-600118 Y How do I post Pics?
    Regards,
    Brian

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Brian, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. The original part number for the crystal is 54-07230 – Jules Borel (in the USA) list a replacement crystal with this part number for case number 4-600118, so if you can find a watch maker with a Borel account he should be able to order one. I’m afraid visitors can’t post pictures directly here, but you can post a link if you upload them to somewhere like Photobucket. Otherwise I can email you and I could upload them (no need to post your email address, I get to see that when someone posts a comment).

      Stephen

  19. arsov says:

    Hey Stephen,
    Great blog and info here. Thanks for making all this available. Can you please help me with my Citizen Valiant?
    Everything on the back is as follows:

    parawater citizen stainless steel
    4-180721 TA
    10701798
    63-1078

    From what I’ve read I think it must be from July 1971 or July 1961.
    Can you help? 🙂

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Arsov, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments 🙂

      Your Valiant model has the 18 ‘Homer’ movement inside, which is the Homer hand winder with date complication. This movement was first made in 1962 and stayed in production until about 1975. You are right that the production date is July, and since the movement wasn’t available in 1961, it was made in 1971. This is also confirmed by the style of the model number – 63-1078 – which was not used until the mid-1960s, and the ‘parawater’ marking, which was used up to about 1972/3.

      The movement is a nice one – in good condition these are reliable and accurate. I hope yours is running well 🙂

      Stephen

  20. Maik says:

    Hello Stephen,
    i just get my old Citizen back from my watchmaker (Daydate doesn´t work correctly 😉 ) and in wanting to know how old my watch is, i found your very good blog.
    Since Citizen is not so present at watchcollectors, for me it has a great history. I thought the watch must be from the early 1970th, but i am not sure about ist. Can you help ?
    The Case Number is 4-653360 TA
    Serial Number 50500844
    and Model Number is 61 9213

    The watch has a dark brown shaded dial, in the middle its nearly silver, very strange colour…
    If i would know how, i would send a Picture of the watch, maybe you would like it.

    Sorry for my bad english, i´ve done my best !
    Greetings from Germany

    Maik

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Maik, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 Your English is fine, and much better than my German!

      Your watch has the 6501 movement – this was first made in 1971. So you are right that yours is from the 1970s. The serial number gives a production date of May 1975 (50500844). The 6501 is a nice movement, but it only had a short production run since Citizen started to produce quartz movements at that time and they stopped development of their mechanical movements.

      I am interested in the dial design of yours – shall I email you so that you can send pics?

      Stephen

      • Main Biermann says:

        Hello Stephen, thank your for the fast answer, please give me your mail contact, so that i can send you a picture of the 1975 wach.
        I did not find it in the Blog.
        Tanks + greetings
        Maik

  21. Joe Seet says:

    Hi Stephen,
    Hope to find you well. Need to seek your advice on a citizen watch that I am thinking of buying. This is a 70s citizen, skeleton dial and mechanical. I do not have the model or case number. Conditions is extremely fine but it is not a big size watch. Question, is this a collectabile watch? I am thinking of collecting and not investing. Any information of this type of skeleton dial citizen? Hope you can help. Many thanks

  22. charles says:

    Hi Stephen
    I have a citizen eagle 7, 21 jewels automatic 8200 movement the back gives the following info CITIZEN, water resist, stainless, 4-823176 SMH, 22429023, 71-3554
    Does this movement use pure or synthetic rubies. Recently I had given it for repair for a small time guy im scared that he would have changed any parts and replaced it with fake is it possible? Is there any way to find out if he did? Please help me with this one

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Charles, thank you for visiting my blog. There is no need to worry about the jewels – they will be synthetic rubies, as used in the vast majority of watch movements since they first appeared in 1902. They are fine and in fact are better since they can be made with great precision, unlike natural stones, which can contain flaws. The 8200 automatic is a well known movement, which has been in production for a long time and parts are available so I’d be surprised if any fake parts would be used. Did the watch guy charge you for replacement parts, other than jewels? Typically if a watch has been well used, then pivots and jewels may need replacing. I would think only an experienced watch maker could identify whether a repair has been done correctly. If the watch is working well and has decent accuracy then probably all is well. Poor repair or failure to replace worn parts would lead to poor running and lack of accuracy. Also, a properly serviced watch will have a good power reserve, i.e. it will run for around 40 hours when fully wound (and for an automatic this has to be tested off the wrist of course so there’s no movement to keep the watch wound).

      Stephen

      • Charles says:

        Thanks for the quick reply. 1.From
        the given case back info given in which year my watch was manufactured its decade month, etc can u interpret it for me? It has two languages one Arabic and the other English for day.
        2. Just replace parts of it with fake or replacing the complete movement with fake one
        3. How can I find out of if they are replaced
        4. He told me that he did oraling for the watch and lubricated the parts as it was jammed.

  23. Charles says:

    That was very helpful. Yes, I have typed the no’s correctly I have given u the complete information about the case back in my 1st comment. On the dial near the 6 o clock position it is printed P-8200A and 6-811108SMH

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Charles, thanks for confirming the serial number. Unfortunately it is unusual – the typical format for a 7 or 8 digit number would give the last part of the year first, which is ‘2’ on yours, and the next two digits would give the month. So it would be 01 for January, through to 12 for December. The next two digits in yours are ’24’ which appear therefore not to provide the month of production. I’ve not seen a serial number like this before, but if we assume the first ‘2’ relates to the year, then yours is from either 1982 or 1992. The Eagle 7 models were made through the 1980s and 1990s so an exact year is hard to pin down.

      Stephen

  24. Hui says:

    Hi Stephen,
    My name is Hui from Thailand.I found your blog from serching the serial number in serch engine. Can you please help me to find how old is this watch and it’s history (if possible). It’s CITIZEN (Manual Winding Movement). For the details, featuring a gold-tone stainless steel case and bracelet with a black dial. It’s show only number XII and CITIZEN trade mark at below of number. Back made from stainless steel and show Case number “4-163389 SMW”, Serial Number “8011439” and Model Number is 75-2321 JAPAN GP.
    Finally I hope these information wil help you find the answer. Thank you so much for your help.
    Hui.

    • sweephand says:

      Hello Hui, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 From the model number (75-2321) and case number (4-163389) I believe your watch uses one of the 011/23/51/53 family of 21 jewel hand winding movements. These were different versions of a small movement introduced around 1975, mainly used as far as I know in ladies’ watches. If your watch has no second hand, it has one of the 011 movements. The other versions have second hands. Here is some info and a picture of the movement: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&Citizen_0150

      The serial number gives us the production date – since the movement was made from 1975, it looks like (from the first digit of the serial number) that yours was made in 1978. The next two digits give the month, so it was January of that year.

      I hope this helps,
      Stephen

      • Hui says:

        Thank you very much for your kindness. Actually, this watch is my girlfriend that she had just got as gift from her aunt and it look like a new one when compare with it’s time.
        If she know about your info, I think she must be glad.
        Khob Khun Mak Krub(Thank you very much).
        Hui.

  25. Gordon says:

    Hi could you please give me some more information on my two watches. the black and silver one is an eBay Indian “serviced” watch that runs ok but the day is impossible to get correct and it has about 3 languages on the days. the cutlass runs lovely and just a little honey of a watch.
    many thanks Gordon



    http://i61.tinypic.com/2hxugpu.jpg%5B/IMG%5D

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Gordon, thanks for visiting my blog, and for posting links to your photos. The Cutlass is interesting – I have seen a couple of others like this, and it appears to be an early Citizen ‘sub-brand’, i.e. it has no Citizen signature on the dial or back. So it is not be confused with Citizen’s earlier ‘Cutlass’ automatic watches, which were fairly high grade models in the mid to late 1960s (e.g. https://sweep-hand.org/2012/07/01/this-weeks-featured-watch-36-the-cutlass-33-jewels/). What indicates that your hand winder is a Citizen watch are the model number, 63-5618, and the case number, 4-020294, and the case material code – CSP. The case number is the best indicator since it includes the movement number – 02 – which means it has Citizen’s Homer movement. This was first produced in 1960, and was made for around 20 years appearing in a number of models. It is a very sound and reliable movement, and the 21 jewel second setting version was issued to Japanese National Railways staff. More info on the movement can be found here: https://sweep-hand.org/2012/02/23/this-weeks-featured-watch-23-the-homer/. ‘CSP’ stands for Citizen silver plate, which is the case finish, with a stainless steel back. The serial number on yours indicates a production date of July 1972 (from the first three digits).

      Your Eagle 7 automatic has the 8200 movement inside. This was first produced around 1975, and the Eagle 7 range was launched in the 1980s. The 8200 became Citizen’s standard automatic as the development of other mechanical movements was dropped in favour of quartz models. Like the 02 Homer, the 8200 is a good movement, and can achieve very good accuracy. Although production of watches using this movement spans more than 30 years, given yours is an Eagle 7, I would think it harks from February 1988 (from first 2 digits of the serial number). It’s a shame the day mechanism is faulty, but donor or replacement 8200 watches can be found fairly easily on eBay.

      Stephen

  26. SG says:

    hi there, I loved this very accurate page for Citizen watches; can you help me with my one?
    here what can I see on back case:
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO.
    4-280334 KT
    30903741
    71-1837
    around is written:
    all stainless steel – water resistant
    is an Automatic 21 jewels with double language DAYDATE (spanish/english)
    thank you,
    SG

    • sweephand says:

      Hi SG, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment 🙂 Your watch is an ‘Eagle 7′ – it uses the 21 jewel 8200 automatic movement first produced around 1975, which runs at 21,600 beats per hour. This movement became Citizen’s standard automatic, like the Seiko 5, and has been in production ever since. The information on the case back of yours is as follows:
      71-1837 is the model number; 4-280334 is the case number and 30903741 is the serial number. The serial number helps us date the watch – the first ’3′ is for the year and the next ’09′ is for the month. So it was made in September of 1983 I would think – it could possibly be `93, but the 8 digit serial number is more typical of the 1980s and earlier.

      Stephen

      • Hi I have same citizen model with same case number.
        The serial number is 90909448.
        Im finding it hard to decode the date of manufaturing?
        Can you please decode it
        Thank You!

        • sweephand says:

          Hi, thank you for visiting my blog – I am sorry for my late reply, but I’ve had to replace my computer this week and going from WinXP to 8.1 has been a bit of a challenge 😉

          The serial number on your Eagle 7 model indicates a production date of September 1989 (‘909’ at the beginning of the number). As far as I can determine the Eagle 7’s appeared in the 1980s and were produced right through to the 1990s.

          Stephen

          • Thank You Stephen..
            This watch is made Japan for Middle East Market,
            So it has ‘DAY’ in both English and Arabic,
            (It was inherited to me form my grand father)
            I recently serviced it ,Now its running good!
            25 Years old, Amazing piece of Engineering!-

            • sweephand says:

              Good to hear you have kept the watch in the family – I’m not surprised that it is running well, Citizen have always made good quality movements.

              Stephen

  27. SG says:

    thank you very much Stephen for your accurate and detailed answer; I was trying to do it by myself but I wrongly identified the watch as a 1973 one.
    Anyway I am happy with it even if I was looking for an older model (I got it on eBay Spain).
    have a good day!
    Simone

    • sweephand says:

      You’re welcome Simone 🙂 If you are looking to buy again, please do not hesitate to ask about it here, I would be happy to check it out for you.

      Stephen

  28. Antonio Cita says:

    Dear Stephen, I purchased a Citizan Alarm Date. Its serial number is 91110135. I tried to understand the S/N by myself, but I think I am quite wrong. Could you help me, please? Thanks. Kind regards
    Antonio

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Antonio, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 The first three numbers in the serial number are used to date the watch. To get the year of production – indicated by the first digit in the serial number – we need to know which decade the watch was made in, and this can be difficult with some models. Citizen first made their alarm watches in 1958, using the 98 movement, and they followed this with a second version with the 31 movement in 1964. The key to dating yours is that it is an alarm date . The early versions were without the date complication, so your watch can be no earlier than 1964. Production of the alarm date models continued into the early 1970s, but not as late as 1979, so your watch was made in 1969. The second and third digits give the month of production, so yours is from November of that year. I hope this answers your question, but please ask if there is anything else,

      Ciao,
      Stephen

  29. MR.KEN says:

    hi there, I loved this very accurate page for Citizen watches; can you help me with my one?
    here what can I see on back case:
    CITIZEN
    WATER RESISTANT
    STAINLNESS
    4-283686 KT
    30202634
    71-3775
    GN-4W-5

    please explain me. Thank you so much…Happy new year with the best

  30. MR.KEN says:

    and front case red eagle

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mr Ken, thank you for visiting my blog, and apologies for not replying sooner. Since your watch has the eagle emblem on the dial, it confirms that you have one of the ‘Eagle 7’ models. Usually these have the 8200 automatic movement in them which was first produced by Citizen in 1976. The Eagle 7 line was introduced on the 1980s and were made through to the 1990s so it can be difficult to determine just when they were made. The style of the model number (71-3775) and the case number (4-283686) suggest to me it is from the 1980s, so from the first three digits in the serial number it looks like yours was made in February 1983. ‘GN-4W-5’ (or ‘S’ more likely I think) is the case type code, indicating a water resistant case and crystal with a screw on back.

      I hope this helps – all the best for 2015,
      Stephen

  31. emgoldexbe says:

    Hi.
    My grandpa passed away almost two years ago and left me his watch. I can’t read english very well and I’d like to know more about this watch.

    On the back it’s written :
    Citizen Watch Co.
    Base metal YP
    6010-S13505 SMW
    9 1 1 4 4 7 2
    -> 5

    Thanks

  32. Sabrina says:

    Hello. I have had this watch for 30 years. It is a hunt citizen. It date’s to the mid 50’s. On the back it shows. .GP. stainless steel back. 14502.the front face .shows Para shock. 17 jewel. Would love information on where it was made and possibly some sort of estimate price. It’s in excellent condition. Thanks.

  33. Craig says:

    Hello there my watch isnt vintage but love to no what year it was made the markings on the back are 4-R12021 RC
    864398
    GN-4-S i think its round the year 2000
    Thanks in advance

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Craig, thanks for visiting my blog – your watch is one of the later Eagle 7 models I believe, with 100m resistance and an external bezel. I would think it is from June 1998 (from first two digits in the serial number (864398).

      Stephen

  34. Thanks for the reply

    By any chance would u know what the price would be roughly

    Cheers in advance

  35. Dean says:

    Hello, I would appreciate finding out the age and more info on my dad’s Eagle 7 Automatic watch I recently received. On the front dial, it says P-8200-R09159-KY and the markings on the back are below. I’ve discovered the days are in English/Spanish and it seems to be running fine but I would love it if you could provide a link to care and maintenance instructions (I assume I do not wind this?) and the best way to keep it running smoothly. Thank you, Dean

    4-R10842 RW
    710072
    GN-4W-S

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Dean, thanks for visiting my blog. The Eagle 7’s were made for a long period so dating them can be difficult. The style of the case number (4-R10842) and the six digit serial number (710072) suggest to me that it is one of the later models. So it could be from 1997 – if that seems too recent then it may be 1987. Sorry I can’t be more specific! Although an automatic, the 8200 can be hand wound, which is handy if you don’t use it all the time, and a bit of hand winding is recommended to give best performance. Here’s a link to instrucitons: http://www.citizen.com.hk/upload/instruction_manual/8200__E.pdf

      Other than what is advised in the instructions, an automatic will need to be serviced from time to time to reduce wear and keep it running accurately and reliably. If you want to use the watch regularly and don’t know when or whether it was serviced before, it might be worth getting it done to keep it in top condition.

      Stephen

  36. Dean says:

    Thank you for the link and information, Stephen. Is there a directory somewhere where I can find someone qualified to work on my Eagle 7 in my area? (Phoenix)

    • sweephand says:

      I’m afraid I don’t know of a directory. The Eagle 7 (8200 movement) is a relatively straightforward automatic so any good watch repairer should be able to service it. I’ve had a quick search and found this one recommended, on the WatchUSeek forum, in Tempe AZ so not far from you 🙂 : http://www.donaldsonwatchrepair.com/ They work on high end watches, like Omegas, so I don’t know whether they would also take on a (relatively) lowly Citizen! Worth contacting them I would think. If they don’t want to do it they may recommend someone else in the area….

      Stephen

  37. Lilly Jordan says:

    Hi I’m wondering if you can help me identify the model of what was this watch. I have only the back as I found it washed up on the beach. The front has been destroyed and rusted out.
    The back reads:
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-038835 SMK
    91000264
    GN-4-S
    I read the year ends in a ‘9’ but I am unable to determine the decade it was made.
    thanks!

  38. Marco H. says:

    Hi,
    I bought this vintage Citizen 21 Jewels because I like the square case.

    The back is marked as follows:
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-039050 SMK
    30308921
    NH 4000
    GN-4-S

    When I started my research on it, I got very conflicting information. When I type in “NH 4000” at google, mostly some kind of diver watch appears. It seems that the type “NH 4000” is often used for marking “fake watches”.

    I´d be glad, if you could give me some further Information about this watch, esp. if I got an original Citizen or just another (older) fake.

    Greets
    Marco

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Marco – thanks for visiting my blog. The diver watches with these numbers are believed to be fakes. The dial numbers are not correct, some of them have the same serial numbers, and a number of them suddenly appeared for sale on eBay a while back. However, 4-039050 is a legitimate case number, and I have seen a couple of examples, also marked NH4000, which are from the Eagle 7 line: https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSJgMiPOwIpL3BjT3cUNB9GeJDxShuiRnPo4ZuzGVXJS8-B0KQ

      Is this the same as yours? If so you have a correct one. Made in 1983 I should think form the serial number,

      Stephen

      • Marco H. says:

        Dear Stephen,

        thank you so much, that´s exactly my watch!


        I tried to link a photo in my last comment, but it seems that didn´t work.

        I´m very happy now to know a bit more about this watch!

        It´s good to know a guy like you with that amount of knowledge!

        Greets from Germany

        Marco

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Marco – you’re welcome and thanks for the links to the pics of your watch. I’m afraid visitors can’t post photos directly here, only I can do that.

          Stephen

  39. John Dawes says:

    Very interesting blog. I have a 1971 Cosmotron which has no model number code on the back, unlike other Cosmotrons of the same year that i have seen. Also what is the significance of the ‘TA’ at the end of the top line code? Again other Cosmotrons of the same year appear to have a ‘Y’ instead.


    John…..

    • sweephand says:

      Hi John, thanks for visiting my blog. Nice example – I have a soft spot for the X8 / Cosmotrons 🙂 Good question about the ‘TA’ etc. I have not been able to pin this down, but my best guess is that they are a factory mark. They are not part of the case number, i.e. 4-810082 (catalog pics don’t include the letters in the case number). For your information, here’s a scan of your model from the 1971 catalog:

      Stephen

  40. John Dawes says:

    Thanks for the catalog entry Stephen, quite surprised how relatively cheap it was in 1971, I have a couple of 1970’s Seiko quartz watches that cost in excess of 40,000 Yen when they were new.
    I have another, later (1974) Cosmotron, but sadly it has a small crack in the crystal and a replacement would appear to be impossible to source :0(

    John……

    • sweephand says:

      Hi John – 18,000 Yen was a medium priced watch in 1971; the most expensive Cosmotron in the 1971 catalog was 34,000 Yen. The limited edition titanium cased X8 Chronometer was 45,000 in 1970. Quartz was new in those days, so they were very much more expensive at first. In 1977 the quartz models were 50,0000 and upwards. The ‘4 Mega’ was 4,500,000!

      Is your other Cosmotron case number 4-870034? I have a white dialled version of that if so. The crystal part number is 54-60551 – I can only find one possible supplier, Jules Borel in the USA:
      http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=Y%60WKWIXF Unfortunately they have a minimum order for international customers, I think it’s a couple of hundred dollars, so best route is to find a friend in the USA who has an account with them!

      Stephen

  41. John Dawes says:

    Thanks for the reply Stephen. The case number on the ‘square’ Cosmotron is 4-790146Y model number is 60-5115 so not the same :0(
    I have a couple of US contacts who may have accounts with Borel, so will bear that in mind for the future.

    John……

  42. rex says:

    Hello,
    Thanks for the informative website. I recently acquired this 21 jewel automatic Citizen with no extras to give me any clues as to what it is…. just a plain watch face with standard embellishments with day and date.
    case back reads:
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    BASE METAL YP
    4-039726 K
    31100187
    GN-4-S
    JAPAN

    Thanks in advance for your help.
    -Rex

  43. Emgo says:

    My grandpa passed away almost two years ago and left me his watch. I can’t read english very well and I’d like to know more about this watch.

    On the back it’s written :
    Citizen Watch Co.
    Base metal YP
    6010-S13505 SMW
    9 1 1 4 4 7 2
    -> 5

    Thanks

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Emgo, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is a quartz model which I am not so familiar with, but I will give as much information as I can about it. 6010-S13505 SMW is the case number and this indicates that the movement inside is a 6010. ‘YP’ is ‘yellow plate’ so it is a gold tone watch. ->5 indicates where the case back can be levered off, i.e. the 5 o’clock position. The first three numbers in the serial number – 9114472 – help to date the watch, but I’m afraid I don’t know when this movement was produced. From the style of the watch and the case back, I think it is most likely from November 1989.

      Hope this helps,
      Stephen

  44. Kim Dae Hun says:

    Thank you so much for your valuable information. I got a pretty old Citizen from my father. and i found #31202772 on the back. Could you adivse the production date of it ? Thanks.
    Mr.Kim Dae-Hun in South Korea

    • sweephand says:

      Thank you for visiting my blog 🙂 Can you please tell me what else is on the case back of your father’s watch, and what is on the dial? If we can identify the model, it will help determine the production date,

      Stephen

      • Kim Dae-Hun says:

        On the back, it is written
        ” CITIZEN
        WATER RESISTANT
        ALL STAINLESS STEEL
        31202772
        HMC ”
        I’d like to post some picture of it as above. but i have no knloweldge.
        Hence, could you refer to my blog ” blog.naver.com/k9801010 “. I uploaded front, back pics. Thank you in advance.

        • Kim Dae-Hun says:

          Further in above,
          On the Front,
          ” CITIZEN
          QUARTZ

          JAPAN-M 84HM-2040″

          • sweephand says:

            Thanks for the additional information, and for the link to your blog. Unfortunately visitors aren’t allowed to post images directly here. Since here is no case or model number on the back of your watch, which would have helped identify the movement, I’m basing my thoughts on the dial code. Since it starts with ’84’ I would think the movement is an 8400 quartz module. I can’t find much info about this unfortunately, but the 8410 version was used in the first radio controlled watch in the early 1990s. These movements would give accuracy of +/- 15 seconds or so per month. I think your watch is from the 1980s, since there were other models from that period with the subsidiary second hand. If I’m right about the 1980s, the first three digits in the serial number (312) give a production date of December 1983. It could possibly be 1993, but the 8 digit serial number is more typical of the 1980s.

            Hope this helps,
            Stephen

            • Kim Dae-Hun says:

              Thank you for your kind and professional explanation. I am very happy to get a valuable information on my watch for your help. My father also said to me it might be over 30 years. but he couldn’t know exactly when it produced because he received the watch from his father also. I think it is real Masterpiece which can be passed down through generations with their own memory.
              Thank you again. – Kim Dae-Hun

  45. Lisa says:

    Hi there,
    I’ve got an old watch and I am curious as to what the numbers on the back all mean…
    Citizen
    Base Metal YP
    3220-893476 SMB
    421677
    32-9588
    I think This watch belonged to my Grandmother
    Thanks
    Lisa

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Lisa – thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is a quartz model – the markings are as follows:
      ‘Base Metal YP’ – this indicates the case is gold tone, i.e. yellow plated
      ‘3220-893476 SMB’ – is the case number. 3220 is the movement designation. I believe ‘SMB’ refers to the factory where it was made or assembled
      ‘421677’ – is the serial number. The first two numbers help to date the watch, but I am less familiar with quartz watches. I guess it was made in either February 1984 or February 1994.
      32-9588 is the model number.

      Hope this helps,
      Stephen

  46. T.L. says:

    Hey, I’ve been trying to figure out what year this watch is. I just bought it from eBay and I’ve been trying to date it. All I can gather is its possibly made in the year 19×8 in April and it was the 1125th model made that month. Could you help me determine the year it was made? Here is a picture:

    If that doesn’t work I can link it:

    Thanks

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, and thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid visitors can’t post pics here, but the link works 🙂 I need to see the dial though to get a better idea of the year it was made – could you please upload one and post a link?

      Stephen

      • T.L. says:

        Ok. Here’s the link:

        • sweephand says:

          Thanks for the link – your watch has a re-painted dial. These are usually done in India, typically to an automatic with the 8200 movement which I guess had a wrecked dial. The model number is a valid one, so it most probably has the 8200 movement inside. I think the original watch was probably from 1988.

          Stephen

  47. JackBlack says:

    oh hi! can you help me identify some information about this watch

    30 microns
    C.G.P
    STAR
    Stainless steel back
    HD 1B0306
    11223T9

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. Looks to me that you have a ‘Homer Date’, the date version of the hand winding Homer family of watches. The style of the markings on the back, and the presence of ‘STAR’ (the case factory) and 30 microns (thickness of the gold plating) suggest it is one of the early ones. These were first sold in 1962, and in fact this fits with the serial number (11223T?9) where we get a production date of December 1961 – from the first three numbers. This would fit with it being sold in 1962, since the watches would of course be built in advance of the sales launch. Are you sure it is a ‘T’ in the serial number, or is it a ‘7’? I’ve not seen a serial number with a letter in it like this. I would think the model number is HD 150306 too, that would be typical of these early models. These movements run at 18,000 beats per hour and came with 17, 19 or 21 jewels – they were in production until about 1975.

      Have you got a dial shot? It would be interesting to see it 🙂

      Stephen

  48. Mike says:

    Hi nice information. I have a citizen 6000 with number 4-601033y do you know anything about this watch??? I can’t find anywhere information. It says 17 jewels and if you could give me a price It would be great. Thank you again

  49. melissa says:

    I have a citizen homer watch and i was wondering what year it was from how much it was worth. The model number is HO150802 and the serial number is 40300368. It has the word ‘star’ and ‘stainless steel’ also on the back. Thank you for your help.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Melissa – I believe your watch is from 1964. It’s not likely to have any great value, although in very good to mint condition it would be of interest to collectors
      Stephen

  50. Hello there my watch isnt vintage but love to no what year it was made the markings on the back are :
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    Water resist
    Base metal CP
    8200-075382 M
    411143
    gn-4w-s

    Thanks in advance

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Cristian, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m travelling at the moment so will reply in a couple of days,
      Stephen

      • I appreciate your help very much, I await your response. You are doing a great work and helping much people.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Cristian, thank you for your kind words – much appreciated 🙂 Sorry for the delay in replying. Your watch is an ‘Eagle 7’ using the 8200 automatic movement first produced in 1976. It can be difficult to date these since the movement has been used by Citizen for many years. The Eagle 7 range was introduced in the 1980s and was made through the 1990s. The style of the model number – 8200-075382 – and the six figure serial number (411143) suggest to me that it is one of the later ones, so I would say it was made in November 1994.

          Stephen

  51. Patsy Gardner says:

    My dad says he purchased this watch in Switzerland in 1945-46. he is. 90 so this could be confused with one of the other watches in the bag.
    90410986
    44-2585
    4-730917Y
    GN 7W5
    Citizen quartz
    Japan
    Stainless
    Can you tell me if he is correct on the year. Or near value?

  52. Hello! I’m glad I found this blog. I have an old citizen that I absolutely cannot take the back off of. I’ve taken it in to a number of places and all they’ve done is tear up the back trying to open the case. I’d be glad to post pictures if you’re willing to give it a look. It’s a two tone from the late ’80s, black and gold GN-4W-U, 4300-432142K.

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks for visiting my blog – my knowledge mainly covers older mechanical watches. I don’t know what kind of case back is used on yours, and I’m surprised to hear that your local watch guys can’t remove it. Screw on case backs can be very tight, especially if there is some corrosion, but yours should have needed a battery change every two years so it shouldn’t have been left untouched for many years unless it hasn’t been used. Sorry I can’t help any more than making these observations – for info here’s the technical manual for your watch: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/4300.pdf

      Stephen

  53. Russ says:

    Firstly a huge thank you for all your dedicated work! The blog is amazing and its incredible to see you’re still responding to requests for help.
    I don’t think mine is all that exciting, but I’m struggling to find any images of the exact watch online, and id love to know what it is and get a new battery for it and have it serviced as its been sat in a box for a very long time and id like to wear it again. It was my granddads. I wondered if you’d be as so kind to turn you skills into having a look?

    Citizen Quartz Crystron
    4-860161 Y
    50713027
    50-0510
    6N-5-S

    Images:

    Many Thanks.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Russ, thanks for visiting my blog and thank you for your kind comments – much appreciated. Thank you for the links to your pics of the watch, they are very helpful – although you say it is ‘not all that exciting’ it is great to know that you have your grand father’s watch 🙂 Like you I haven’t been able to find any images of the exact same model either, but seeing ‘8620’ on the dial tells us that the quartz movement inside is an 8620. And this was one of earliest of Citizen’s (and anybody else’s) quartz modules, so was quite a special watch in its day, since it was new technology then which we now take very much for granted. One version of the movement, the 8650, was used in the ‘Crystron 4 Mega’ model in 1976. It was accurate to about +/- 3 seconds per year, quite astonishing then when the best mechanical watches managed something like that accuracy per day! The 4 Mega cost 4.5 million yen though. Anyway, back to your 8620 – this had an accuracy of +/-15 seconds per month when it left the factory, so still considerably better than conventional mechanical watches at the time. The first Citizen quartz models were launched in 1973, but initially not badged ‘Crystron’ just ‘CQ’ – ‘Crystron’ was introduced around 1975 I think, and was used not only on analogue models like yours, but also on the first LCD and Solar Cell models introduced in 1976.

      The marks on the case back are the case number (4-860161), useful to watchmakers when servicing the watch and if parts were needed, and it also provides a clue to the movement inside. 50-0510 is the model number – less useful, but ’50’ is consistent with watches that use the 8620 movement. ‘6N-5-S’ is the case type code, indicating a water resistant design, with screw-on case back. And finally the serial number – 50713027 – which gives the production date. Since the 8620 moments were introduced in the 1970s and were probably obsolete by the mid-1980s, this indicates a date (from the first three digits) of July 1975, so one of the first Crystrons ;).

      As to the battery, the Citizen part number for that is 280-01 so an alterantive can be fond, for example the Renata 301. Here’s a link to a battery conversion chart, and the 280-01 is conveniently on the first line 🙂 : http://www.battery-house.co.uk/reference.html

      How is the crystal on yours? If it needs replacing it can still be found (part number 54-61111).

      Stephen

  54. Ivan says:

    I have an Auto GN-4W-S
    4-821068-Y
    70900322
    51-1439
    Can you tell me something about it?
    Thank You

  55. catalin says:

    hello. i have a citizen diver watch with 8200 movement, but, although i fiind your table very accurete i have a difficulty to date it. can you help me?
    on the caseback it is stamped:
    4-824181 Y
    524410

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. The problem with dating watches with the 8200 movement is that it was produced for many years – from around 1975 right through to the 2000’s. And the serial number only helps when we know what decade the watch was made in, otherwise we don’t know whether it was 1975, 85, or 95. I think it’s safe to assume it isn’t 2005! The model number (4-824181) is useful since that isn’t a number for any of the 1970s divers, so 1975 can be ruled out. I’m not so familiar with post-1980 watches, but my best guess is 1995 – the styling of the dial suggests this to me, as well as the 6 figure serial number. The older models typically have 7 figure numbers. I can’t be definitive about the date, but I hope this helps.

      Stephen

  56. Nikola says:

    Dear Sir,

    I am writing this post because I have a dilemma about a dress Citizen watch I own.
    First I want to thank you for your blog which is a great source of information. Real dedication and love for vintage timepieces is needed for such a job.
    Back to my watch. I cannot tell how old is my Citizen. Actually I own two almost identical watches, the main difference is in the colour of the dial. The problem is in the fact that there is no serial number on the back case. The movement is 8210, other numbers are 4-820932SMH and 72-9051. Here are the pictures:
    [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/znse2x.jpg[/IMG]
    [IMG]http://i62.tinypic.com/95rgbk.jpg[/IMG]
    [IMG]http://i57.tinypic.com/20qgl03.jpg[/IMG]
    [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/33ekkz8.jpg[/IMG]

    Also maybe some additional data could help. The glass is plexy with an inner metal ring, the watch is 38 mm wide and lug to lug is 39 mm.The crown is signed with CTZ. Also one interesting thing is that the movement has 17 jewels not 21 as most 8210 have. The other almost identical watch with silver sunburst dial has 8210 with 21 jewels. Maybe it is not important but I cannot recall that I have ever seen 8210 with 17 jewels.
    If you could help me to define the age of my watch and to comment the number of jewels (17) I would be grateful.
    I look forward to hearing from you.

    Yours faithfully,
    Nikola

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Nikola – thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments. Also thank you for all the information you have provided, including very good images. Although your pics don’t show here (I’m afraid visitors can’t post images directly) I’ve browsed the URLs and had a look at them. As you’ve discovered this particular model (72-9051) doesn’t have a serial number. This is unusual but Citizen did this on some models, unfortunately. But first the easy bit 🙂 – the 8210 was indeed made with 17 jewels, although the 21 jewel versions are seen much more often. The 17 jewel versions were effectively the ‘entry model’ automatics – they have printed rather than applied Citizen logos and….no serial number!

      So, what can we say to determine the likely production date? We can’t pin this down exactly, but can get pretty close to the year of production. In very general terms the use of ‘water resistant’ makes them post 1972/3 (that is the latest ‘water proof’ or ‘para water’ was used). More specifically the 72-XXXX model numbers feature in the 1977 casing parts catalog I have, but in there the second part of the numbers all start with ‘0’, e.g. 72-0178′. Assuming Citizen numbered their models logically, then yours are later than 1977. I can pin it down further by looking at a catalog I have from 1979, where some very similar models are listed – 8210 movements with 17 jewels, printed Citizen logo and similar case numbers to yours. The case number on yours is 4-820932, and the number in the catalog is 4-820908. So I think it is safe to say that your watches are most likely from 1979, or possibly 1978. Here’s a rather poor scan from the catalog which also shows the original price in 1979:

      Hope this helps,

      Stephen

      • Nikola says:

        Hi Stephen,

        Thank you for precise, detailed and fast answer. You have met my expectations.

        If you don’t mind I have one more watch I can’t determine age. It is not my watch but from forum’s colleague but still we are not able to define the exact age.
        It is Citizen 7, serial number is 21100590, other numbers are 4-280351KT ; 71-1951. Movement is 8200A.
        Here are some pictures.
        [IMG]http://i59.tinypic.com/6is1w4.jpg[/IMG]
        [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/2d9twlw.jpg[/IMG]
        [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/206cvhy.jpg[/IMG]
        Sorry for the links, don’t know how to post a picture so it can be visible right away.
        I must say that I’m not sure if the plexy is original or not.

        I’m looking forward to hearing from you.

        Best wishes,
        Nikola

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Nikola – you’re welcome 🙂

          Your friend’s watch is an ‘Eagle 7’ and these can be hard to date since the Eagle 7 range was made from the 1980s and right through the 1990s. The style of the model number (i.e. like yours) and the 8 digit serial number suggest to me that it is from the earlier part of the production run, so I would say November 1982.

          Stephen

          • Nikola says:

            Hi Stephen,

            Thank you once again. I’m amazed by your will to help. So many watches so many dilemmas and still your commitment is amazing.
            Keep up the good work.

            Best wishes,
            Nikola

  57. ferdz says:

    Hi! my cousin in law gave me an old citizen watch. The watch is in very good condition I want to know the manufacturing date. At the back etched 8200-V66398E SJ the serial number 4040385

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thank you for visiting my blog. From the model number you’ve given this is an automatic watch with the 8200 movement – does it have an eagle shaped ;logo on the dial with ‘7’ at the centre? The 8200 movement was used for more than 30 years, so dating them is difficult. The style of the model number and the seven digit serial number suggests to me it is not one of the earlier ones, so I would think this is from April 1994.

      Stephen

  58. Theo says:

    Hi Stephen,
    As with most others, im trying to find out more about a watch which i recently purchased. My initial course of action was to hit the web, and i was lucky enough to stumble upon this page! It seems Ive found the Citizen timepiece guru, so i’d like to thank you in advance for your effort and consideration!
    I have what appears to be a Citizen Newmaster. Im guessing its from the 70’s?

    Face: Dark grey, date window at 3 o’clock position.
    Left of center – CITIZEN
    NEWMASTER
    Right if center – AUTOMATIC
    21 JEWELS
    Back: Screw on type.
    CITIZEN
    ALL STAINLESS STEEL
    WATERPROOF
    852701
    70801656

    Would appreciate any information about the watch.
    Thanks a lot,
    Theo.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Theo – thanks for your kind comments, and for all the info from your watch. Citizen used the ‘Newmaster’ name from the early 1960s for a variety of models, usually I think for export. The name was used most commonly on hand-winding models with the ‘Homer’ (02) movement (first produced in 1960). But it was also use on some automatic models, including one with the ‘jet’ rotor that also had 21 jewels, produced in 1962. Given the style of the markings on your watch case back, I don’t think it has the jet automatic. However, the markings don’t tell us what movement is used, unfortunately. Since it is marked ‘waterproof’ the watch is earlier than 1973, so the serial number tells us that it is from August 1967. At that time the likeliest movement is the date only version of the 52 movement, i.e. the 54 calibre. If you are able to take the back off, then a small movement number. e.g. 5403, should be stamped close to the balance wheel. Is there a number on the dial, just below the 6 o’clock marker?

      Hope this helps – once we know the movement I can tell you a bit mopre about it,

      Stephen

  59. jonlevine says:

    Hi Stephen. Great blog and very informative. Like most, I’ve discovered an old Citizen that belonged to my Grandfather that I’d like some information on.

    The watch face is marked “41 Citizen Alarm” and the back case
    STAR
    STAINLESS STEEL
    1507062
    10600931

    Here are a couple of pictures for reference. Thanks!

  60. jonlevine says:

    Whoops, the picture links didn’t make it. Let’s try that again:

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jon, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments. I’m sorry about the difficulty of getting pics on here – only I am allowed to post them directly, as you have discovered! You have an interesting watch. Citizen first made alarm watches, using a Swiss hand winding design, in 1958 – it was designated the ’98’ movement. It was phased out by about 1967, with the introduction, in 1964, of the ’31’ version of the same movement, typically offered with 21 jewels and a date complication. Bar some versions of the later movement, in my opinion the earlier version are more interesting – and they are certainly, generally speaking, rarer. First a slight correction to your description 😉 The logo on the dial is actually a stylised ‘4H’ rather than ’41’, i.e. it stand for ‘4 Hands’ since the alarm pointer adds one to the standard three.

      These earlier models have what is known as a ‘cricket’ back – I haven’t got one of these myself, but I believe that there is an inner back against which the alarm hammer strikes, and the outer back helps to amplify the sound. The later versions have a simple flat snap on back, with a pin riveted to it against which hammer strikes. Some of the early models had a rotating disk to set the alarm, and they are very hard to find. The movement is relatively simple, with a separate spring for the alarm, and runs at the standard 18,000 beats per hour. Is the watch running and the alarm working?

      As to the markings on the back – ‘STAR’ was stamped on Citizen’s cases until the mid-1960s, and was the shortened version of the name of their case factory. ‘Stainless Steel’ is of course the case material. ‘1507062’ is the model / case number and would have been used by watch makers to order parts if needed when doing a service or repair. ‘10600931’ is the serial number, and gives us a way of dating the watch. The first three digits are the year and month. ’06’ gives us June, and since these were not made before 1958, or after 1967, this one was made in 1961.

      It’s really nice that you have found your grand father’s watch – do you think he bought it new? I hope it’s running ok, but if not it would be great to get it ticking away again 🙂

      Stephen

      • jonlevine says:

        Thank you so much Stephen for your reply and for the awesome information.

        Yes, the watch is running like a champ and the alarm still works without fail (and is loud). I do believe that my grandfather purchased this watch new as he spent several years traveling back and forth to Japan for work in the 1950s and 60s and I’m guessing that’s where he got it.

        I’d like to start wearing this watch, but unfortunately, I don’t have the original strap. Do you happen to know what size strap would fit this watch?

        Thanks again.

        Jon

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Jon – you’re very welcome 🙂 It’s always good to hear from someone who has a watch that has been ion the family since it was new. And great to hear as well that the watch is running well. I would recommend getting it serviced (by a skilled watchmaker) if you are going to wear it regularly – that will make sure it is thoroughly clean and freshly lubricated.

          I would think the strap width is a standard 18mm on these, but worth double checking by measuring the gap between the lugs, i.e. where the ends of the strap connect to the case. This model most likely came on a leather strap originally. I would think a smooth or finely grained strap would suit it best – here’s a scan showing a little bit of the straps:

          Stephen

  61. Filip says:

    Hello. Can someone tell me anything about this watch:
    citizen 21 jewels
    parawater 4-020642TA 63-4239

  62. Hello. My boss almost tossed this woman’s Citizen (Elegance- I think. Hard to read even under a magnifier!) watch into her garage sale. Something tells me its special! Can you help me find out any extra info?

    Approx. 1/2″ Oblong turquoise (changes to purple in light) face w/gold accents. Chain links look like 4 gold leaves making an “X” with a Brown jewel in between.

    Facts in back:
    Citizen Watch Co.
    Base Metal UP
    5421-629657 HSW

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Brigitte, thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for a late reply. I’m afraid I can’t help a great deal with this watch. Since it is a quartz model, I’m not as familiar with it as I am with the older mechanical watches. 5421-629657 is the model number, and this also tells us that the 5421 movement is inside. Base Metal UP (or is it ‘GP’?) meaning that it is a plated case. I’m afraid these watches are not of any great value, but if you search eBay for ‘Citizen 5421’ you might find some examples. Here’s a link to the relevant technical manual: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/5400.pdf

      Stephen

  63. Stormy says:

    I am hoping anyone on here can help me. I have been buying vase lots of watches from Goodwill for years now and from time to time have a rough time identifying them. This one I can find but NO WHERE have I found it with the black Dial that this one has. It is a moon Phase watch and wondering if this one is worth more d/t color and metal band. PLUS, downside is there is no back on this watch.. ;(

    • Stormy Bates says:

      It is a moon phase 2870 with a black metal band and black face and dial. I can’t seem to load pictures!

      • sweephand says:

        Hi Stormy – thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I can’t help with quartz models – a quick look around the net didn’t bring up any black dialled examples. It’s not possible for you to post pics directly here, but you can post a link if you have uploaded them somewhere. Sorry I can’t be of more help.

        Stephen

  64. Michael says:

    Am trying to find out whether this model has a SAPPHIRE crystal or one made of MINERAL GLASS: BL9009-54F — Any help would be appreciated, including a link with such info. Many thanks.
    Michael

  65. Christina Haryanto Putri says:

    Could you help me to recognise my watch. It is written in the back Citizen Watch Co, Water resist, Stainless, 4-039190 SMK, 30101344, GN-4W-S. My father bought me this watch in 1994. I would like to know the specification, series dan if possibly its price now. Many thanks for your help 😁.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Christina, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is an ‘eagle 7’ automatic, with the 8200 movement inside. The 8200 was first produced in 1976 and was made for over 30 years. It became Citizen’s ‘workhorse’ movement and has proved to be reliable and reasonably accurate. Your example was made in January 1993, which fits with it being a gift in the following year. These 21 jewel movements run at 21,600 beats per hour, and can be hand wound as well as winding automatically when on the wrist. Here’s the instructions for the movement for your information: http://www.citizen.com.hk/upload/instruction_manual/8200__E.pdf

      The value is not high for these models I’m afraid, if you search eBay for ‘Citizen 21 jewels’ for example, you should get an idea of what they sell for.

      Stephen

  66. Arnold says:

    Can you please tell me what year this watch is or roughly what its worth i inherited it from my grandfather the back plate is
    CITIZEN
    watch co
    4-168089sms
    6080383
    73-1064
    japan
    G.P

  67. Wagner says:

    Hello Stephen, thank you for all info you have been sharing in your blog, very useful! I’m about to buy an old citizen watch, what can you tell based on the info in this picture. Is it a good one? How much do you think I should pay?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Wagner, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments. The asking price for the watch seems much too high to me. Although it looks ok, I haven’t got any references to a 52 movement (including the 5270) with 17 jewels. The 7 Star Deluxe models I’ve seen have higher jewelling than that, with 21 being the lowest. Although I may not have all the info on the 52 movements, I wouldn’t get too excited about this one unless it can be bought cheaply.

      Stephen

  68. Jame says:

    Hello Mr. Stephen.
    Can you help me identify a citizen watch which seems to be quite old. It is sqaure in shape.
    CITIZEN Para shock
    GP 4-020090 S
    0121121
    63-5821

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jame – thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is a hand winder with Citizen’s 02 ‘Homer’ movement inside. In good condition this is a sound and reliable movement that was first produced in 1960 and was made right up to around 1980. The style of the model number (63-5821) and the case number (4-020090) tell me it is not one of the earlier ones. The first number in the serial number (0121121) gives the production year, so it was either 1970 or 1980. If the dial or case back is marked ‘parawater’ or ‘waterproof’ then it is 1970. If it is marked ‘water resistant’ then it is more likely to be 1980.

      Stephen

  69. Charlene says:

    Hi, thanx for the interesting articles on the Citizen watches. Pls can u assist me in finding out if the watch is worth anything to a collector? It would be greatly appreciated…

    On the Back:
    #66-9121
    Citizen GP
    Stainlessback
    4-930134 S
    9080513

    The dial:
    19 Jewels
    And at the bottom by the 6 dial (not to sure)
    JAPAN 6 – 320506 (it could also be 23?)

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Charlene – thanks for visiting my blog. You have a women’s watch with the 9300 movement inside, which is a small hand winding calibre made in the early 1970s, possibly the late 1960s. The model number (66-9121), the case number (4-930134) and 19 jewels on the dial are all consistent with the 9300 movement. The dial code, which I guess is hard to read on the small dial, should be 6-93xxxx for this calibre – do you think that might be what’s on yours?

      I’m afraid women’s watches just aren’t collected so value is low as a result.

      Stephen

  70. Jamie says:

    Hi, I recently purchased a citizen 21 jewel automatic watch and just wondered if you could tell me more about it . I’ve had a look around your site and the movement pdf but I’m still struggling to find out when it was made etc

    On the back:
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO
    4-062957 SMT
    00450418
    GN-4W-S
    71-1918

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jamie, thanks for visiting my blog. From the information you’ve provided I believe you have an 8200 automatic. This movement was first produced in 1976 and remained in production for over 30 years, which makes dating them a little tricky. Also the case and model numbers don’t help in identifying what is inside. However, I know that the ’71’ model number prefix was used in the late 1970s for 8200 models, and the eight digit serial number is also typical of that time. So, from the first three digits in the serial number it looks like yours was made in April 1980. There’s more info on this movement here if you search for the 8200 automatic (doing this on my phone so struggling to paste a link).
      Stephen

  71. Gerard says:

    Hello Stephen / Sweephand.

    Can you guess what the build year of this Citizen watch will be ?

    http://www.horlogeforum.nl/t/tranquility-base-here-the-eagle-has-landed/56647?u=carpe_tempus

    The movement would be the Citizen 8200A
    with a German & English date wheel
    My guess would be April 1988, but could it be 1978
    or even 1999 ? .. the condition is flawless
    so it would be a miracle if it is truely 1979.

    4-R02149 RW
    840496
    GN-4W-S

    Thanks for your assistance. Gerard

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Gerard, thanks or visiting my blog. Your watch looks to be in perfect condition 🙂 It is an ‘Eagle 7’ model of course, and these were not made before the 1980s. They were made through the 1980s and 1990s, but I’m not sure when production ended, which makes dating it more tricky, but we can rule out 1978. The style of the case number – i.e. the inclusion of the letter R – is also indicative of a later Eagle 7, and the six digit serial number is also a later type. So it is either 1988 or 1998, but I’m afraid I can’t be sure which it is. Sorry I can’t be any more specific, but I don’t have reference material on the Eagle 7’s.

      Stephen

  72. Toonsak says:

    Dear Stephen, Thanks so much for sharing the Great information on the casing. I need your help to identify my watch. I guessed it made of silver. On the back case, it is marked “CITIZEN, 4-850106 Y, 6070754, JAPAN 925 SILVER” and on the face, it is marked “citizen quartz, CQ, JAPAN 8520-85014-Y”. Can you please determine the year of production? Many thanks in advance

    • sweephand says:

      Hi and thank you for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. Your watch is one of the early quartz models, with the 8520 movements inside. These were expensive watches when new, since quartz technology was still new at that time, and a silver cased one would have been very expensive. The ‘925’ quality mark (i.e. 92.5% pure silver) is used on solid silver, but sometimes can be seen on silver plated jewellery. But Citizen usually used CSP for silver plated models, so is yours solid silver do you think? ‘8520-85014’ is the model number, whilst 4-850106 is the case number. The serial number – 6070754 – tells us that is was made in July 1976.

      Stephen

  73. nanci harper says:

    Hi, I have a ladies gold colored watch, given to me around 1980 or 1981. I am not sure if my husband purchased it on the Navy base where he was stationed (Either Oakland or Muir Island) or in a bay area jeweler. The face is oval in shape but the oval goes horizontal. The dial is marked with lines, not numbers. The watch is not working, it was a winding watch if I recall and the stem is very loose. The “band” is actually part of the watch, making it a bracelet design. The markings on the back are:
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO
    BASE METAL TOP
    4 15 26 45 FN (we think its an N but not positive)
    86-0808
    7090453

    Can you help me identify it, and also please advise how to get it running again? It is sentimental. Someone suggested years ago that I should just replace the insides with a battery operated movement but I did not want to at the time. What would you suggest? I can email photos of front and back if you want. I didn’t see anything like it on your site, but also have not seen every single photo!

    Thank you very much.

  74. Nanci harper says:

    Thank you so much for the information! I will take it to a jeweler and go from there. My goal is just to be able to wear it and pass it down to my daughter or granddaughter at some point as a sentimental gift. Nice blog!

  75. Deepak Singh Rawat says:

    Hi Sweephand

    I am glad to come across your Website sweep-hand.org.

    I have a Citizen Watch of my father which is arround 30-35 yrs Old. below is the details ON THE CASE BACK:-

    CITIZEN
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-286723 KT
    30400935
    71-4097
    GN-4-S

    My question is the case change possible for its machine. I want to shift the machine in to todays modern case.

    Plz reply soon

  76. Ms. D. Carol says:

    I was hoping you could help me figure out the date of my Citizen watch and if it is worth anything. I would greatly appreciate any information you can provide.
    Back of Self Winding Watch:
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO
    Base Metal Top
    4 15 32 94 FN
    86-3262
    9030585

    Thank you,

    • sweephand says:

      Hi and thank you for visiting my blog. The case back information indicates that your watch has either an 015 or 671 movement inside. This is a compact movement used in women’s watches. The model number – 86-3262 – and the case number – 4-153294 – are both typical of this movement type. As far as I know they are basically the same design, but the 671 was a later version. These movements were made in the 1970s/early 1980s, so the serial number (first 3 figures) give a production date of March 1979. The puzzling thing is that these are hand winding movements, but you describe it as self-winding, i.e an automatic.

      I’m afraid, even in very good condition, these are of no great value – women’s watches are not collected so there is not really a market for them.

      Stephen

      • Ms. D. Carol says:

        Thank you for getting back to me. I really appreciate the information you provided. When I stated it was “self winding”, I meant I wind it myself. I’m sorry for the puzzling information on my part. *giggling*

  77. Ceren says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I couldn’t find the exactly same back with my watch that I’ve bought from a second hand bazaar. Could you please take a look at?
    It says these with this order:
    CITIZEN
    BASE METAL YP
    3220-320514 YO
    6120234
    32-522B
    JAPAN

    Thanks!

  78. Andreas says:

    I hope you can help me. I have a ladies gold colored watch. I cant find the clock on the Internet.
    Details on the back case:
    Citizen
    Citizen Watch Co.,
    Base Metal YPM,
    5920-F92659 YO,
    990392,
    Japan -> 10

    Have you more Details for this watch. Also possibly price information.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Andreas thank you for visiting my blog and apologies for my slow reply. I’m afraid I can’t help much with relatively recent quartz models, since my area is older mainly mechanical watches. Your watch has a 5920 quartz movement, and this number forms the first part of the model number. Yours is a plated watch, and was probably made in 1999, from the first figure in the serial number. I’m afraid these models have little value these days.

      Stephen

  79. James says:

    Hi there,
    Firstly I just wanted to say what a fantastic blog this is, keep up the good work!
    Secondly I just wanted to ask if I may, I have an old citizen ’21 jewels’ automatic that I’ve recently acquired and I was just wondering if you would be able to tell me anything about it?
    The info on the case back as it appears is as follows:
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-038843 SMT
    91167494
    GN-4-S
    JAPAN
    I would attatch a few images but I can’t for the life of me work out how!
    Many thanks,
    James

    • sweephand says:

      Hi James, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments – much appreciated 🙂 The information from your watch indicates that it is an ‘Eagle 7’ model, with the 8200 automatic movement. The case number – 4-038843 – suggests this modal. This movement was first produced in 1976 and was produced for over 30 years since it became Citizen’s ‘workhorse’ automatic, offering long term reliability and reasonable accuracy. If yours is an ‘Eagle 7’ then these were first produced in the 1980s, and given the 8 digit serial number I would think it is from 1980s. So the first three digits give a production date of November 1989. GN-4-S is the case type, meaning it is water resistant with a screw down case back. There’s more on the 8200 here: https://sweep-hand.org/2013/01/27/the-8200-movement-citizens-standard-auto/

      I’m sorry about images – visitors aren’t able to post them directly here. You can post a link if you have uploaded images to somewhere like PhotoBucket.

      Stephen

  80. jass says:

    hey u give me plzz any info about this watch
    i want price of this watch
    Citizen watch Co.
    water resist
    BASE ST.STEEL
    1012-R002767 RC
    840165
    GN-O-S >4

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I can’t help with your watch since it is a fairly recent quartz model, and I avoid valuations. Try searching eBay for Citizen 1012 models to get an idea of value,

      Stephen

  81. Hello and thank you for this informative blog! I have this Citizen watch for women:

    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    BASE METAL SSG
    6000-R00413 RW
    4C301223
    GN-4W-S

    Could you help giving it a date and a general evaluation?
    How do I post photos?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Matteo, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. Unfortunately I’m not so familiar with Citizen’s quartz movements, especially the more recent ones. I’ve found examples of your watch for sale on eBay and some are described as being as recent as 2000-2009. If you search using the model number (‘citizen 6000-R00413’) then you will find examples and get an idea of their value. So yours could be from 2004 (from first figure in the serial number – 4C3012223.

      It’s not possible for visitors to post pictures directly here, although links to somewhere like Photobucket can be posted.

      Stephen

  82. Daniel says:

    Hi bro..i want to ask u about my watch..i cant find the information about my watch..citizen crystal seven automatic 4-770145Y / 10531324

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Daniel – thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid the case back on your watch is incorrect for a Crystal Seven. Assuming that the movement is right, it will be a 52 movement, so the back should have a case number of 4-52xxxx. The 4-77xxxx back is from a later watch which would have a 77 movement inside. If you can get the back off, you will be able to find the movement number stamped near the balance and hairspring.
      Stephen

  83. Talha Shakil says:

    hi i have a citizen that shoudl be over 30 years old.

    here is what it says on the back:

    CItizen
    Watch Co.
    4-731662 TA
    90301778
    GN-4W-S

    could you please check and tell me the model number and year of manufacuter. plus i want to know if the chain/bracelet has been changed or not so wht did the original look like.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Talha – thanks for visiting my blog. From your pictures it looks like your watch doesn’t have a model number, just the case number: 4-731662. Occasionally Citizen didn’t give a model number – I don’t know why! I don’t know the quartz models so well, but I have seen similar designs to yours with 7300 movements in a 1979 catalog, so I reckon yours is most likely from March 1979. The catalog models had similar bracelets too, so I think yours is probably original.

      Stephen

  84. Yash Jain says:

    I want to know the price of my citizen
    Case back :-
    { CITIZEN
    BASE METAL
    2030-205235
    4035535
    31-5681 }

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I don’t try to do valuations here. I would advise searching eBay for similar watches to yours to see what they sell for. Try searching eBay for ‘Citizen 2030’ and you will find some examples.
      Stephen

  85. Debbie Hall says:

    Hi
    I’ve been given my grandfathers citizen watch and would love to know more about it. The information on the back is as follows:
    Around the edge it says, PARAWATER, CITIZEN, STAINLESS STEEL.
    In the middle it then has the following
    4-600215 Y
    AUTOMATIC
    10437742
    62-8018

    I would be extremely grateful for any help you could give
    Thank you

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Debbie, thanks for visiting my blog. Your grandfather’s watch is from April 1971 – the production date is determined by the first three figures in the serial number (10437742). The movement inside is a date only 6001 automatic, which was made from 1971 until around 1975, so the year it was made can only be 1971. Although Citizen is better known for their more recent quartz and eco-drive technology, they made very nice mechanical watches in the 1960s and early 1970s. These movements are good quality, reliable and capable of very accurate time-keeping when in good condition. They run at 21,600 beats per hour, which had become the typical running speed at that time (previously it was 18,000 beats per hour).

      4-600215 is the case number, which was used by watchmakers when they serviced watches to source parts if they were needed, and helps to identify the movement. 62-8018 is the model number, which is of less use, although ’62’ was used for the 6000 family of movement.

      ‘Parawater’ was used by Citizen before 1972/3 for ‘waterproof’, indicating that the case and glass were designed to be resistant to water and dust.

      Does your grandfather’s watch have a black or silver dial? I have seen both versions.

      Stephen

      • Debbie Hall says:

        Hi Stephen

        Than you so much for your reply. It was really helpful. My grandfather had both black and silver dial versions of the watch bought on separate occasions while on holiday in Jersey . I have the silver version.

        Thanks again

  86. Teddy says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I just received my first Citizen and while searching for info on it I came across your blog. I was wondering if you could help me with some info on it….

    Caseback:
    CITIZEN
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-286723KT
    40400389
    71-4097
    GN-4-S

    The serial number is a little faded but I can send you pics if that would help.

    Thanks in advanced!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Teddy – thanks for visiting my blog. Looks to me like you have an 8200 automatic. The 8200 movement was first produced around 1976 and soon became Citizen’s ‘workhorse’ mechanical watch, in production for over 30 years. It’s a sound and reliable movement, capable of very accurate time-keeping when in good condition. There’s more info on it here: https://sweep-hand.org/2013/01/27/the-8200-movement-citizens-standard-auto/

      4-286723 is the case number, and the ‘4-28′ bit is indicative of 8200 models, as is the ’71’ model number. GN-4-S is the case type, and this code indicates a water resistant design with a screw down back. 40400389 is the serial number, and we can get the production date, year and month, from the first three figures – 404. Since it’s an eight digit number, I reckon it’s a relatively early one, from April 1984. Does it have an Eagle motif on the dial as in the Eagle 7 line which was introduced in the early 1980s?

      Stephen

  87. Sergio Ribeiro says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I read all your lines, but i could use your help, as i cannot identify the watch i have here.

    What i know is that has been bought in Germany, and the Back Case have this:

    CITIZEN WATCH CO
    WATER RESISTANT
    BASE METAL YFM
    5930 – 079213M
    861222
    GN-O-S
    –> 5

    The las line has an arrow with the number in front of it.

    I you can leave me all the details you know about it, i will appreciate.

    Best Regards,

    Sergio Ribeiro

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Sergio, thanks for visiting my blog. Unfortunately your watch is a relatively recent quartz model, so I can’t help very much. I would guess it’s from 1998. The model number – 5930-079213 – tells us that it has the 5930 movement inside. The arrow pointing at 5 indicates the area where the back can be prised off, i.e. the 5 o’clock position. You can find some instructions and more info about the movement be finding ‘5930’ in the list of movements here: http://www.citizenwatches.co.za/instruction-manuals

      Stephen

  88. Uritu Laurentiu says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I have a Citizen watch labeld as bellow:

    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO.
    4-167678SMT
    00233378
    74-6355
    CCP

    It works perfectly , looks very good and i’m wondering how old it is and if it has any value.

    Best regards!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Uritu, thanks for visiting my blog. I have had someone ask before about this model, so here is what I said: ‘the markings on the case back give us information about the watch – the model number is 74-6355, and 4-167678 is the case number. Watches with similar numbers (model number beginning with ’74’ and case numbers with ‘4-16’) have the hand winding 51xx movements, which were first made around 1975. It is a small movement so it was used in women’s watches.’

      The serial number correctly tells us yours was made in February 1980 (‘002’) and the case material code – ‘CCP’ – indicates that it is chrome plated. You don’t see these watches very often, since they were ‘entry level’ models and most probably would be discarded after a few years rather than serviced / repaired. Unfortunately women’s watches are rarely collected so they do not have any great value.

      Stephen

  89. Donna S Wilson says:

    I have a Black Men’s Citizen Elegance Serial # 8020815. Other # on back is 3620. S0725. SMV. ->5. It has 4 little diamonds on front face at 3-6-9-12. It has gold hands. Any info would be appreciated.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Donna -thanks for visiting my blog. Unfortunately I am not so familiar with Citizen’s quartz models, since my knowledge is mainly on their older mechanical watches. The model number of yours tells us that the movement is 3620, and the serial number suggest a production year of 1988 although I can’t be certain of that. -> 5 means that the case back can be prised off at the 5 o’clock position. I’m afraid I can’t tell you much more.
      Stephen

  90. Ian says:

    Superb blog! My question – when did Citizen start (or stop) using the Eagle motif on the 7, esp. the automatic. I’ve seen one: 4-280351 KT, serial 20802158, no mention that it’s auto on the case back and no motif on the dial. Any idea of the year?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Ian, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. The Eagle 7’s were introduced in the early 1980s, and were certainly made throughout the 1980s and 1990s, but I’m afraid I don’t know exactly when they stopped, or even whether they were made into the 2000s. The early 8200s didn’t have the Eagle 7 logo, and given the markings on the one you’ve seen I would think it’s from August 1982. I have found another on the internet with the same case number, also from 1982 and that does have the Eagle 7 motif. So a question to be asked is whether the one you’ve seen has been re-dialled or re-painted – there are a lot of 8200s around with changed dials. Can you post a link to a pic of the watch?
      Stephen

  91. Kirsti says:

    Hi Stephen,

    Thanks so much for your informative blog!

    I have been autumn cleaning and came across a Citizen watch and have no idea where I collected it from. I have been searching the net for two days and can’t seem to find one pictured that is alike and have read through your blog and can’t find one with any of the same movement numbers. I would really appreciate your help with some more information on the watch please.

    The front dial face is white, Marked Citizen Quartz with a CQ emblem at base above the number 6, numeral numbered dial with a numerical date window where the “3” would be positioned. At the base of dial face in extremely small lettering is – movement Japan, dial Taiwan, P20106, 874479Z, SMO

    Printed on the back casing is:
    Citizen
    Water resist
    Base metal CP
    2010-891261 SMT
    61012853
    36-9039

    It has a winder button and isn’t functioning at present.

    Thank you in advance for any information you can provide.

    Kirsti

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Kirsti, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comment. Unfortunately I can’t help much with quartz models since my area of knowledge is primarily related to the older mechanizer models. Many thousands of quartz models have been made so they come and go very quickly, and very little if any reference material is available. Your watch uses the 2010 movement, but I’m afraid I don’t know when these were produced. The best I can do is this link to the relevant technical manual: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/2010.pdf

      Stephen

      • Kirsti says:

        Thank you so much for this information Stephen. Like I said, I have no idea where I picked this watch up and wasn’t sure if it was old or new. My watch does look similar to the one in the manual. I will put in a new battery and see if it runs. Good luck with your future endeavors 🙂

        Cheers,
        Kirsti

  92. Tom says:

    Hi,
    My grandfather gave me his citizen watch and if you could help me i would like to know when and where it came from. I think its from the 70s or 80s but im not sure.
    In the front says : Citizen Automatic, 21 Jewels, P-8200 and 283730-KY.
    And in the back:
    Citizen Watch Co.
    4-280717 KT
    10405155
    GN-4W-S
    71-2175
    And around all this info says ALL STAINLESS STEEL/WATER RESISTANT

    Thanks! Great blog

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Tom, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. Apologies for a slow reply. Your watch has the 8200 movement inside, which was first produced around 1976, so it can’t be earlier than that. The 8200 was produced for over 30 years, so they are difficult to date. The first three figures in the serial number – 10405155 – are used to give the production date, and since it has 9 (should it be 8?) numbers it suggests to me that it is from April 1981. Citizen had factories in Japan, Mexico and Korea, and assembled watches in Germany, but I don’t know exactly where this one was made I’m afraid.
      Stephen

  93. Andreas says:

    Hello, this is a fantastic page. I hope, you can me help. I can all of my Citizen watches assign with this page. But i have watches of other manufactures. Know such sites for other watches manufacturers. I could find nothing.

    Thanks for yours help.

  94. syahirah says:

    Hi Stephen! What a nice blog you have here. You see, my father just gave me his late mother’s Citizen watch to me and I really like to know its production date because it is still working until now so im a bit amazed haha. So,here’s some details on the back of the watch:

    CITIZEN
    BASE METAL TOP
    STAINLESS STEEL BACK
    4 – 230221 S
    6061568
    65 – 2733
    JAPAN
    CCP

    And oh, in front it says 17 jewels. I really hope you still can answer my question (because all I see the comments are from 2013 until 2015 haha) Thank you so much! May god bless you!

    -Syahirah

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Syahirah, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind words. Don’t worry if the dates on previous comments are older ones, I’m still here 🙂 Thank you for the information from the case back which tells us that your grandmother’s watch is a hand winding model with a 2302 movement inside – these were first made around 1975. I’m not surprised it is still running today, since Citizen’s movements from that period are of very good quality. The serial number – 6061568 – gives us the production date, which was June 1976 (‘606’) so it’s about to celebrate its 40th birthday 🙂
      Stephen

  95. Joss Pafort says:

    20160522_140356.jpg,20160522_140607.jpg,20160522_140608.jpg
    20160522_140609.jpg Hello I wonder if you can see the pictures. I hope you will help me with my questions, what do you think about this watch? Could it be a counterfeit? It is a watch I bought in India. Just incase I write down what it tells on the back case:

    Citizen
    Watch CO.
    4-281080 KT
    011012 70
    ON-4W-S
    71-2591

    I would appreciate your answer. Best Regards, Joss

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Joss – thanks for visiting my bog. I’m afraid visitors aren’t able to post pics directly here. You can post a link if you have uploaded them somewhere, or let me know if you want me to email you so you can send them to me. Stephen

      • Joss Pafort says:

        That would be great if you can email me. Thanks you for your fast response. Regards, Joss

  96. Gary Norman says:

    Hi I just purchased a vintage citizen watch
    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESISTANT
    STAINLESS
    4-038843 SMT
    11140058
    GN-4-S
    JAPAN.
    Any information or help were I can find info would be much appreciated. As I would like a traditional strap for it. I believe the watch is late 70s but not sure.

  97. Joss Pafort says:

    Hello Sweephand, can you please email me so I can send the pictures? Thanks, Joss

  98. mariana says:

    hola tengo un reloj que pertenecia a mi mama. solo quiero saber si es original o no?
    CITIZEN
    BASE METAL YP
    6031-G03715 TA
    90913968
    JAPAN – 9
    es color dorado y funciona le puse pila apenas, solo quien me atendio en la nota puso imitación, asi que quiero saber. como es viejito quiero quitarme la duda obvio el papel es ya mas palido pero tiene incrustada de metaldonde marca las horas.
    adelante del guion 9 es una flechita la que tiene el rejol depues de la palabra japan
    en la caratula, arriba de la palabra citizen tiene dos piedritas aderidas de forma vertical . gracias espero me puedan ayudar

  99. Matthew says:

    Hello,
    A few years ago, I inherited a portion of my Grandfather’s watch collection. He had around 300 watches when he passed. There are two that I believe might be fake Citizen.. So I was wondering if you could help.

    Watch #1:
    4-038282SMK.. 30300915 – 71-3686 – GN-4-S

    Watch #2:
    4-063139 SMK – 00501874 – 71-2132

    I’ve scoured the internet but haven’t had any luck. They are still working, so it is no big deal if genuine.. They have sentimental value. If they ever need repair, I would just rather avoid the embarrassment of taking in a fake 🙂

    Thanks for any advice or direction you can give.
    M

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Matthew, thanks for visiting my blog and apologies for my late reply. The case numbers (eg. 4-038282) for both watches are genuine Citizen numbers, and the model numbers (e.g. 71-3686) are also appropriate for what appear to be automatics with the 8200 movement inside. They are probably from 1983 and 1980. Without seeing the dials I can’t say whether they are all original, since many 8200’s have had replacements or repaints done. If the dials have codes printed beneath the 6 o’clock marker (usually starting with 8200-) then they are likely to be original. Lack of dial codes is often a good indication of a replacement/repaint. Stephen

  100. robby hall says:

    I have a watch that was my grandmothers and can’t figure out the date and value.. Hoping you could help me out.. It’s a 7 jewel.. The model number is 4-041399 smw.. The other id# is 1063263 and last bottom number and letters r bx-3023..i would like to find a lil about the watch.. Hope u can help me..

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Robby, thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for my late reply. I believe your watch is a women’s quartz model most likely from 1981. I think the ‘seven’ on the dial is a model name rather than jewelling. I’m afraid quartz models are not my speciality so I’m struggling to give more information. Unfortunately quartz watches do nto have any real value these days. Stephen

  101. raju Parmar says:

    my citizens hv hand winding n date , numbr is 4-822285, SMW , 53-1171 n machine numbr 8260 A , what is time model n how much price now

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Raju, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is the hand winding, date only version of the 8200 automatic movement. Since it doesn’t have a serial number, it’s not possible to tell which year it was made, but most likely it was in the early to mid 1980s. I’m afraid these models do not have much value – I would advise that you search eBay for similar models in similar condition to yours to get an idea of current value.
      Stephen

  102. Mark says:

    Hi Stephen
    Thanks for a great blog, loads of great information, really interesting stuff.

    I am fairly new to vintage watches, but find it fascinating.

    I have just purchased from eBay a couple of identical Crystal 7’s, the only difference is one has the days of the week in Spanish. I have never seen them before and can find no pictures on the internet.

    The first has a plain back with the following

    Citizen
    All stainless steel
    Waterproof
    0-51406
    7110712
    OR-D-1

    The other has in a circle

    4-520521Y
    Waterproof
    Automatic
    Stainless steel
    OR-D-1

    And in the centre

    61-5617
    Citizen
    9050185

    They both have a black dial with day/date and Crystal Seven Automatic 21 Jewels. I can’t read the numbers under the 6 as they are so small!!

    The only thing I’ve worked out is one is 1967 and the other 1969?

    Any more info would be gratefully received

    Many thanks
    Mark

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mark, thanks for visiting my blog and your kind comment. The case number on the first one – 0-51406 – does not look right. It should start with 4- like the second, and should have the same number if it’s the same model (although occasionally there can be alternative numbers). You are right about the production dates, but I can’t find any references to the 4-520521 model number I’m afraid. That may not be anything to worry about since there were many Crystal Seven models. The case back markings seem ok otherwise, and suggest export models since they are marked waterproof rather than parawater. I’d like to see pics of the watches – can you upload them somewhere like Photobucket and then post a link here? Stephen

      • Mark says:

        Hi

        Thanks for the reply, I don’t have an account with a photo site, if you email me I can send you some back if that is ok.
        The first watch has been restored and the back heavily polished so hard to read, I will have another look. Under a lens it looks like an 0 but is very faint.
        I have had a look at the dials under a lens and the numbers are as follows
        Watch 1

        Japan 1161-1Y

        The second

        Japan 6-520995-Y

        Hope this helps

        Many thanks
        Mark

  103. marion says:

    Hi Stephen,
    Really interesting blog, thanks! I tried to guess the age of my Citizen Quartz based on what I read on your articles:
    Base metal YP
    4031-Y56627 SJ
    9034662
    QC-5923
    Assembled in Germany

    I assume 1989, what do you think?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Marion, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. I would think you are right about the date. I think ‘QC’ is not correct in the model number – I guess it is worn, but it should be a number. Stephen

  104. Ron says:

    Got a citizen $500.00 watch for 85.00 where I live , eco drive , how would I find the ser #,I know it is on the back , and the watch is great, would just like to know when it was made, that too much to ask? ,Ron, in reno

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Ron, thanks for visiting my blog. The Eco-drive models were first sold in Asia in 1995 and the rest of the world in 1996, so yours can’t be any earlier than that. The serial number helps to date the watch, so look for a long number on the back. The first number gives the year but you’ll need to work out whether it’s from the 1990s or 2000s, which may not be easy. If the first number is 0, 1, 2, 3, or 4 it’s not from the 1990s. Stephen

  105. Noah R says:

    Just got a citizen watch from my grandma, tried to identify it but could not.
    [url=https://postimg.org/image/5gb2zdkc7/]
    [url=https://postimg.org/image/iyhzbnwhj/]
    [url=https://postimg.org/image/6xwjaxp2v/]
    The text on the back is (clockwise):
    citizen watch co., water resistant, GN-4-S, Japan –> 12, 308, ST. steel back, SV925, 6631-664540 Y.
    Also on the strap is says: Japan 17 H. It is a club LA MER watch. It has 17 jewels.
    Thanks for your help.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Noah, thanks for visiting my blog. The Club La Mer range is more recent than my collection so I am not very familiar with them. Your watch has a silver case and uses the 6631 hand winding movement. I believe the La Mer models are from the late 1980s and 1990s. I have seen one of these, identical to yours, described by a knowledgeable Japanese seller as from 1987 (there is no serial number on the exhibition case back so an exact date is not possible). ‘GN-4-S’ is the case type meaning it is a water resistant design, whilst ->12 indicates where the back can be levered off. ‘SV925’ is the mark for sterling silver (i.e. 92.5% silver) and the watch would have been quite expensive to buy when new. Hope this helps, Stephen

  106. Al says:

    Hello Stephen
    I have a question, I have a Square Custom, the movement is 4-521307 Y. So from what I’ve read, the watch was made not earlier than 1965, right?
    And the serial number is 00100499, based on the first 0, can I asume that this watch was made I’m 1970? And bases by the 01 would it be from January?
    Thank you so much for all the useful information in this article.
    Have a great day.

  107. Shalom says:

    Hello. Could you please help me with more info about my watch please?

    GP CITIZEN 6800 4-167171 SMO 5040212
    75-3106 21 JEWELS

    Any info would be greatly appreciated 🙂

    Kind regards,

    Shalom.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Shalom, thanks for visiting my blog. Can I just check something – is ‘6800’ correct, or could it be ‘6600’? I know 6800 is a quartz movement, but of course that wouldn’t have 21 jewels 🙂
      Stephen

  108. Przemysław says:

    Hello I need help to identify my citizen watch. I red information above but I still have a problem to identify it. Could you help me?

    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    WATER RESIST
    BASE METAL CP
    P070-312783 KA

    GN-4-S
    JAPAN->7

    According to information above there should be the manufacturers serial number on the case. But there is not any number. Does it mean that my Citizen is a fake?

    Regards.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. The model / case number (P070-312783) is unusual and I can’t find a reference for it. It can sometimes be hard to read worn numbers and sometimes no serial number is marked. Can you tell me what is on the dial?
      Stephen

  109. Przemysław says:

    Hi Stephen.

    Thank you for your reply. I sent to you email with pictures in attachment but I am not sure if you received it.

    JAPAN 6-311016 YN- this is the number on the dial. Maybe it will helps.

    Regards

    Przemysław

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Przemyslaw, I’m afraid it’s not possible for visitors to post pics here. Shall I email you so that you can send the pictures direct to me?
      Stephen

  110. Maria says:

    Hi my citizen pendant watch has a blue face its automatic with a doubke white libe horizontically in the middle with the words and numbers japan 6-150292 gb on the front and citizen watch co base metal top 4-150716 gd then 86-1375 then 5100189 the r.p running from top to bottom of the back of the case ..can anyone help me identify year model etc thanks maria

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Maria, thanks for visiting my blog. Your pendant watch won’t have a model name as such. 86-1375 is the model number, which most probably indicates that inside is an 015 movement, a small (of course!) hand winding movement made in the mid 1970s. 4-150716 is the case number, which would be used to source parts if needed.The first three figures in the serial number (5100189) tell us that the watch was made in October 1975.

      Stephen

    • 丁日辰 says:

      HI, NI HAO,! I have a watch.
      hope you help me:
      WATER RESISTANT
      ALL STAINLESS STEEL
      4-280202KT
      00807870
      54-8014

      • sweephand says:

        Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. I think the movement in your watch is a 6600, a hand winding high-beat (28,800 beats per hour) model first made in 1970. These were known in Japan as ‘Cosmostars’. The serial number indicates it was made in August 1970.
        Stephen

  111. Tamsin says:

    Hi Stephen,
    I recently bought a hand winding ladies citizen online as a gift and was wondering on the approx. age of it. I think either 1970 or 1980, but I don’t know how to find out information on the movement.

    The back says:
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO
    BASE METAL TOP
    ST. STEEL BACK
    4-168151 SMW
    0018277
    75-0549
    GP

    I also wonder what SMW stands for. I assume GP is gold plating?
    Thanks in advance!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Tamsin, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is from January 1980. The case number – 4-168151 – means that inside is an 015 movement, which was first made around 1975. As far as I know it won’t have still been in production in 1990, so that gives us 1980. ‘GP’ does refer to gold plate, whilst ‘SMW’ is possibly a factory code, although I can’t be sure.

      Hope this helps, Stephen

  112. jason says:

    Afternoon my wife has inherited her nans citizen watch. She would really appreciate any info you could provide please. It has the following markings
    Citizen watch co
    Base metal pdpg
    3220-325362 k
    540237
    Japan > 12

    Thanks jas

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jason, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I can’t help very much with more recent quarts models. I can tell you that your wife’s watch has a 3220 movement inside, and was probably made in 1995, or possibly 1985. I think the case material code indicates a palladium coated case with gold bezel. ‘->12’ indicates that the back can be prised off at the 12 o’clock position. Here’s a link to the relevant technical manual:
      http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/3220.pdf

      Stephen

  113. Tina taylor says:

    Can u pl give me info on GP CITIZEN 6800 4-167155 SMB 501 75-3025

  114. Rasu says:

    Hi there,
    First of all I would like to sincerely thank the creator of this blog. I was reading through all Q&As and I am very impressed with the enthusiasm that you have in watches and intend to help others with their specific questions.

    I have a citizen watch passed on to me from my father and i know for a fact he wore it for atleast 40 yrs. I want to know when was this made and what caliber machine it has. By the way I am wearing this watch and its working great. This is self winding automatic watch
    Back of the watch : | CITIZEN | AUTOMATIC | GN-3-5 | PARAWATER |
    T.G.P.
    4-770099 Y
    10632013

    Watch dial says CITIZEN AUTOMATIC and I guess it has 7star logo on it with ’21 JEWELS’ written on it

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Rasu, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comment. Good to know your father’s watch is still working well 🙂 I can tell you what the case back indicates, but I’m afraid it is not consistent with what is on the dial. The case number – 4-770099 – is for a 77 high beat movement with 26 jewels, as used in one of the ‘Leopard’ models. Here’s an original catalog pic of the watch, it’s the middle one in the top row:

      The ‘TGP’ code goes with this case, i.e. bezel is gold plated, and the 77 movements have the crown at the 4 o’clock position. If your case is different then the wrong case back has been fitted at some point. From your description, the dial is from a Seven Star model, with 21 jewels. There should be a dial code on the dial, below the 6 o’clock marker. If you can let me know what that is (you will probably need a magnifier to see it properly) we may be able to identify what movement is inside. The case back you have is from June 1971, but since that doesn’t seem to be correct, it doesn’t help with dating the watch accurately.
      Stephen

      • Rasu says:

        Yes, it has similar looks with the watches above, with crown on 4 o’clock. But it is made up of steel without any gold plating in it. I found the number below 6 o’clock. It says:
        JAPAN 7200 725554-Y
        I could not figure out to post picture in the post so here is the Facebook link to it. I have posted it on vintage citizen group.
        https://www.facebook.com/groups/vintagecitizenwatches/permalink/722841121187719/
        I am now positive that the watch could be 1971 made since it goes with the history of 40+ yrs of usage. Also I noticed that the 7 star logo I feel is a bit different that the actual 7 star citizen watches. The # 7 in the logo is not obvious 7 in mine. I hope the pictures that I have posted on the link above would be helpful.
        It’s funny but I really get excited when I have conversation about watches with someone who knows more in depth about each details. You are awesome! Thanks again for your quick reply Stephen.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Rasu, thanks for the additional info, and the link to your photos. Unfortunately visitors aren’t able top post pics directly on this blog. The dial code confirms that the watch has one of the 72 movements inside, which has 21 jewels. The logo on the dial was used for export models, with no model name on the dial. Domestic watches would be marked Seven Star V2 or Custom V2. They are ‘V2’ because the earlier Seven Star & Custom models used the earlier 52 movements. So, this does mean that the case back on yours is not the correct one – for some reason it has been replaced at some stage. 1971 is very likely to be the year of production of yours, even though you don’t have the original serial number to be sure. I’ve found another example of yours, which has the case number 4-722109, and it is from 1971:

          Given that the serial number is kind of similar it may be a watchmaker has been careless when doing a service!

          Stephen

          • Rasu says:

            I see, so it is a V2 model. Now I love my watch more for a fact that i know about history and of course it has sentimental values since it is been passed on to me from my father. Thanks to you for sharing all the information! The watch is in working condition and i feel it runs a min behind after couple of days. But i am planning to use it until it completely stops working. Thanks again Stephen for all your help.

  115. onder says:

    Hi i am onder.l want my citizen watch productions date.My watch model automatic stainless 4-038801 smt. 00430285.
    71-4933. GN-4W-5 Do you help me for this.thanks so much for this

  116. Art van Deco says:

    Hi Steven
    i have a crystal 7 auto with these ID marks, can you give any information, please?
    “80100404”
    “ACSG 2904-Y”
    and it is marked parawater

    Art

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Art, the Crystal 7 line was launched in 1965 and was a success for Citizen. They were made up to the end of the 1960s and used the 52 movement which had many variants. There’s some info here: https://sweep-hand.org/2011/06/23/this-weeks-featured-watch-8-the-crystal-seven-27-jewels/ and the ’52 Family Tree’ link in the blog roll also shows the line-up.

      Yours is a gold plated model with the older style model/case number (ACSG-2904). The serial number gives a production date of October 1968.
      Stephen

      • Art van Deco says:

        And also, Stephen, the crystal of my watch is very flat with sharpish edge is this correct for the model? And i must say, the dial and hands are in remarkable condition considering its approaching 50 yrs old, so the crystal has done a good job.
        Art

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Art – yes flat glass sounds right, and they do have a sharp edge. The ‘Crystal’ name was used because these were Citizen’s first model to use hardened mineral glass. And good to hear the face and hands are in good condition 🙂
          Stephen

  117. Lisa says:

    Hi, I’m trying to find out the date my watch was made. The serial number is 0051689. I understand the first number is the ending number of the year, but I don’t know if it means 70, 80, or what. How do you tell?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Lisa, thanks for visiting my blog. Good question! The only way to pin down the production year is to know what decade the movement was made. I may be able to help if you describe as fully as possible what is on the watch dial and the case back – if it is a mechanical watch. There have been so many quartz models made that it is very difficult to date them, unless they are the very early ones. Stephen

  118. John Cantos says:

    Hi Stephen
    Great blog and amazing information
    I am afraid I am lost looking for the right crystal replacement for this piece: Vintage Citizen compressor style diver 4-520343 Y
    Would you please let me know the right reference and, if possible, where to find it out?
    Thanks in advance

    • sweephand says:

      Hi John – thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comment. The crystal for this model is plastic, and the part number is 54-0145. These days it is incredibly hard to find an original replacement. How bad is it? Plastic crystals can be polished fairly easily if the scratches aren’t too deep. Stephen

  119. Liane Willoughby says:

    Hi , can you plz give me any information about a watch , that was left to me , it’s a wind up , silver , with a stretchable wrist band , each p piece of the band has writing and it’s got a white face not with numbers only a line , and the only word on the watch front is citizen the back doesn’t have anything around the edges Citizen watch co base metal top st. steel back4-167635. SMW 2019158. 75-0255. Cop. Thank you

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Liane, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch has a 6710 movement inside, a small hand winding movement designed for women’s watches. The movement is a later development of one that was first made around 1975. These smaller watches usually didn’t have a model name on the dial, so like yours they simply have the company logo on the dial. The model number – 75-0255 – is not very helpful these days, but the case number – 4-167635 – helps to identify the movement. The first three figures in the serial number (2019158) give the production date, which is January 1982. The movement wasn’t made before 1980 or so, and I don’t think it was used in the 1990s, so that makes it most likely that it was from the 1980s.
      Stephen

  120. maripido says:

    Hi,

    I’ve recently acquired this manual wind Citizen from the 70’s (as described by the seller) in New Old Stock condition:
    http://www.ebay.com/itm/201727812761?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

    Caseback shows this:
    CITIZEN
    2520 (this is the movement i believe)
    4-200284 HM
    STAINLESS STEEL
    63-8111

    It doesn’t have a serial number as you can see. The only information I got was from the movement here: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&&2uswk&Citizen_2520&

    The dial shows:
    Citizen (not applied I believe)
    17 Jewels
    Japan 2520 6-200257

    Also noticed that a lot of these models are sold in India at NOS condition which leads me to believe a lot of these are floating around Southeast Asia that were unsold for 30 years or so. It’s sold for 15 dollars to 50 dollars (I got mine for 50 here in the US). I know it’s not a rare or important piece but it looks cool and the condition is great considering its age.

    Is this a legit Citizen watch? Having no serial # – should I be concerned about this?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Maripido, thanks for visiting my blog. This watch looks original to me. The case back markings look authentic, and sometimes on ‘entry level’ watches serial numbers weren’t used. The 2520 movement is an inexpensive hand winder, and the printed dial is consistent with that. Re-done dials are common from Indian sellers, but this one looks to have a proper dial code, which suggests it’s original. The case lines are sharp and the brushed finish is there, so the case has not been polished. I think describing it as ‘NOS’ is somewhat generous though, there are clearly some small marks, but nevertheless it is in good condition. So I don’t think you should be concerned.
      Stephen

  121. Jordan says:

    Hi Stephen. A pleasant day! Can you please take a look at this Citizen watch? I tried searching it online but couldn’t find anything similar. Any information regarding to this watch is greatly appreciated. Would also love to know how old this watch is. Thanks in advance!

    FRONT:
    http://prntscr.com/ddoe4g

    BACK:
    http://prntscr.com/ddoenf

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jordan – could you please tell me what is printed on the dial, i.e. the small print under the 6 o’clock marker, I can’t make it out from the pic. This can help identify the watch properly.
      Stephen

      • Jordan says:

        Hello Stephen! It’s P-8200-R18565-KY.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Jordan, thanks for dial code. This confirms that the watch has an 8200 automatic movement inside. These movements were first sold around 1976, and were then in production for over 30 years. In the 1980s they were used in the ‘Eagle 7’ line and the Eagle 7’s are the ones most commonly seen for sale these days. Citizen also made some with ‘Crystal 7’ dials like yours, imitating the original Crystal 7 range that they made in the mid 1960s. These are rarer than the Eagle 7’s, although they used the same cases, just a different dial. I reckon yours was made in March 1983.
          Stephen

  122. Jordan says:

    Great blog by the way. Very informative. 🙂

  123. Aaron says:

    Hi I have recently bought a Citizen Quartz watch I found at a Garage sale. Above the company name it says XII And on the back it says Water Resist 1022-H14231 HSB 227859 GN-O-S->12 MOV’T Japan was wondering year make and what the base metal was.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Aaron, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I don;t know too much about Citizen’s quartz models, but I would think yours is from 1992. i don’t know exactly what ‘base metal’ is, but I think it is a nickel alloy.
      Stephen

  124. michael clinton says:

    Hello Sweephand, can you please give me Information about my Citizen Automatic.
    On the back case :
    Parawater,Citizen,Stainlees Steel,
    4-5400 18T , Automatic,00103436, 62-7038
    On the dial:
    Citizen,Automatic,Waterproof
    Best Regards
    Michael

    • michael clinton says:

      Sorry, the Serial No. was wrong.Its 01003436
      Michael

      • sweephand says:

        Hi Michael, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is from January 1970, and is an export model of what would have been called a Crystal Date in the Japanese domestic market. The 5400 movement it uses is the date only version of the the 52xx series, most frequently seen in the Crystal Seven watches first made in 1965. The lack of a model name on the dial, and the ‘waterproof’ marking indicates a watch made for export. As you can see ‘parawater’ is on the back, which was Citizen’s word for waterproof. These terms had to be dropped in favour of water ‘resistant’ at the latest by 1972/3, so even if the production date of the movement isn’t known, the use of ‘proof’ helps date the watch. Since these movements were not made before 1965 it must have been made in 1970 (from the first figure in the serial number). ’62-7038′ is the model number, which isn’t that helpful these days, unlike the case number – 4-540018 – which helps with the movement id. More info on where the 54 movement fits in can be found in the 52/Seven Star Family Tree, see here: https://sweephand.files.wordpress.com/2012/04/52familytree-v2secure.pdf

        Stephen

  125. michael clinton says:

    Thanks Stephen for your helpfull Information. GREAT BLOG !!!
    Michael

  126. Robert Miles says:

    Hi, my watch saysOn backCitizenco.WaterRestent Base Metal Yp1032_k12436ck
    1DQ639
    GN_Q_s>10 thank you for your help.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Robert, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I don’t know too much about more recent quartz models like yours, which I think has a small movement as used in women’s watches. Citizen have made many thousands of quartz watches once the technology was refined and mass produced, and there is very little information available on them. I think the 1032 movement is a derivative of the 1030 movement, and here’s a technical manual for information: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/1030.pdf

      I’m afraid I don’t know exactly when this movemnt was made, but I would guess yours is from 1991. Stephen

  127. maripido says:

    Hey Stephen,

    I’m gave the best offer for this particular Cosmotron – http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-Citizen-Cosmotron-X8-Electronic-Quartz-Watch-uhr-MOT/272424058953?_trksid=p2050601.c100085.m2372&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D37338%26meid%3D2bd14eb91f094fcaa490a9a6696798cd%26pid%3D100085%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D272424058953%26clkid%3D1166416023757043044&_qi=RTM2247625

    First off, it’s NOS and has the box and papers and price tag. But what’s particularly interesting about this piece is that it has a see-through case back. The problem though is I can’t find the serial number of this thing. Is this legit? Would you know how or where to find the serial number of this piece? Thanks in advance.

    PS. I’m officially addicted to pre-quartz Citizen electric watches 🙂

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Maripido – that Cosmotron is fine. The glass back is correctly marked with the case number, and the additional letter ‘K’ after ‘SS’ denotes an ‘exhibition’ back. See the same thing on my skeleton model: https://i1.wp.com/i282.photobucket.com/albums/kk252/Sweephand/Skeleton/4-760182back.jpg Unfortunately glass backs don’t have serial numbers, so you can’t get a specific production date. As you probably know already, the 4840 movement was the first X8 / Cosmotron to have a date complication and was launched in 1970. The 78xx movements soon superseded the 48xx – in 1971 – since there was only a short production run you have a good idea of its age to within a year or two.
      Stephen

      • maripido says:

        Thanks, Stephen. Yeah I figured it was from 1970-71 (based on your Cosmotron article). What’s also curious about it is the bracelet – the clasp isn’t signed on the outside but signed in the inside. I’ve done some research on this and I have not seen any Cosmotron bracelet that’s unsigned. Have you seen this before? Do you think the clasp was swapped out?

        BTW I got it for 500 bucks. I do hope it’s still a good deal given that it’s NOS with box and everything in it

        • sweephand says:

          I can’t be 100 percent sure about the bracelet. Certainly most Cosmotrons have the logo stamped on the clasp, but I don’t think this is always the case. I have examples with ‘Citizen’ stamped on the clasp which I am sure are original. It looks like the one on yours is solid link so it is a good quality bracelet, although the plain clasp is unusual. I can’t say I’ve seen this style of bracelet on a Cosmotron, but please bear in mind I’m sure I have not seen them all! I am a bit concerned about the fit of the end links from the seller’s pics but once you have it you may be able to judge better how well the end links fit and whether or not they look right.

          You’ve paid a strong price, but if you hold on to it and keep it pristine it should be a decent investment.

          Stephen

          • maripido says:

            thanks, Stephen. I’ll message the seller to see what’s up. In any case, it’s still a good buy considering it’s pristine and it includes box, papers, price tag etc. He also has another cosmotron for sale on his eBay page, but that one has the signed clasp on.

            I’ll let you know how it goes. Thanks again! More power to you

            • sweephand says:

              Good luck with your negotiations! I’ve had a look at the other Cosmotron, and it looks all original to me, but the bracelet looks to me to have been quite heavily polished (see how the links are rounded off somewhat), and I wonder whether the case has also been polished – the brushing looks a little too coarse, and the case may have been reduced in size. I haven’t got a pic of this model, but I have one of the gold plated version on the same type of bracelet.
              Stephen

              • JOSE Pido says:

                thanks, Stephen! So I talked to the seller – he didn’t want to lower the price since he claims he got it for 400 dollars. So we compromised…he had another cosmotron (not for sale) which had the correct clasp. He agreed to put that on mine. He sent me a pic of it and it looked good. I hope it looks good in person with the Cosmotron clasp

                Does mine look polished to you? Now that we don’t know if the band is orginal to the watch, I feel like I may have overpaid for this piece.

              • maripido says:

                thanks, Stephen! So I talked to the seller – he didn’t want to lower the price since he claims he got it for 400 dollars. So we compromised…he had another cosmotron (not for sale) which had the correct clasp. He agreed to put that on mine. He sent me a pic of it and it looked good. I hope it looks good in person with the Cosmotron clasp

                Does the case on mine look polished to you? Now that we don’t know if the band is orginal al to the watch, I feel like I may have overpaid for this piece.

  128. Ron Boss says:

    Happy Holidays Stephen. I just received a watch that I’m told was my father’s (he passed away in 1976). I was trying to date the watch when I discovered your very informative blog (thank you), but I ran into a huge snag…the watch doesn’t have a serial number (at least I don’t think so), and this is coupled with the fact that it’s a quartz watch (as a mechanical engineer I do understand your lack of interest in quartz watches). But I thought I’d ask anyway since 2 days of searching has been fruitless. I think I only really need to know if the watch was made before 1976, that it could have been my dad’s. If it’s pre-1976, any information would be icing on the cake.

    Info on the FRONT of the watch reads:
    Citizen Quartz
    CQ
    Mov’t Japan
    6100-074588

    Info on the BACK of the watch reads:
    1. WATer resistanT (I am assuming it reads that because a round metallic “tape” is covering the lower case letters…see picture)
    2. BASe metAL (again, the metallic “tape” is covering some letters)
    3. 6100-072910
    4. AD5303-50

    The clasp is stamped CITIZEN.

    I posted pictures of the watch here:
    https://www.dropbox.com/sh/3tnm23qx23ivtm6/AADcql970bvitMZ4FELjJ6Fta?dl=0

    If there’s anything I need to have done such as remove the back or remove the metallic “tape” on the back to help the investigation, please let me know. Also, would you happen to know what/why that metallic “tape” is there? I think I saw someone else’s photo with a similar non-metallic “tape” on the back.

    Best Regards,
    Ron

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Ron, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments. First of all you have correctly read the markings on the case back, so no need to remove the tape. To be honest I’m not sure exactly what that is – new watches usually have a clear plastic disk attached to protect the back, which can be peeled off if preferred, so maybe the metal disk does the same. Although my collection ends with the electro-mechanical and tuning fork watches, I am familiar with the earliest quartz movements which were first sold in 1974. In fact Citizen’s first quartz analogue watch at that time was a hybrid movement with a very fast moving hairspring! As with all Citizen watches the early quartz movements were given numerical id’s, and at that time they were variations of 85xx, 86xx, 88xx and 90xx. The watch you have uses the 6100 movement, which I am sure is a later one. I have had a few questions from visitors about the 6100, and as far as I can be sure, it is from the 1980s. The style of the case is also typical of that decade, and I’ve seen examples with a conventional serial number indicationg 1985 and I think 1989. The lack of a serial number on yours means we can’t pin the production date down, although I am certain it is not from the 1970s. ‘AD5303-50’ looks like a model number, but I’m afraid it’s not a style I know. I hope this helps, Stephen

      • Ron says:

        Stephen, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU! Yes, it’s disappointing that it couldn’t have been my father’s, but it would have been wrong for me to relish it without some basic research (thanks to you). I searched your blog for a Donation and/or Tips button and I can’t seem to find it. Can you please point it out to me or private message. Situations like this, I feel that if we were in a bar (pub?), I’d certainly buy you a beer with much appreciation. Happy Holidays and thank you. Ron

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Ron – you’re very welcome. It is very kind of you to offer a donation, but I am happy just to help people out who are interested in old Citizen watches. Getting feedback like yours is more than enough! I’d love to have a pint with you though 🙂
          Have a good Christmas, and all the best for 2017. Stephen

  129. Nicole says:

    Happy Holidays! After some fervent searching, I’ve come across your blog, and err, I hope you don’t mind, but can you help me find out what year mine was made? It was recently gifted by my mother and she’s had it for years but doesn’t seem to remember exactly when.
    It has the following details at the back:

    CITIZEN WATCH CO.
    BASE METAL YP
    2200-226364 YO
    6040530
    33-7447
    JAPAN => 10

  130. Frances says:

    Hi! I was hoping you could help me in identifying the make and model of this vintage citizen watch. It’s a square black faced automatic 21 jewels one.

    Case back appears as follows:
    Citizen
    Water Resist
    Stainless
    4-663357 K
    40603602
    54-2075
    GN-4-S
    Japan

    Thank you!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Frances, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I don’t have access to my reference material for a few days. I hope to reply by the end of the week. Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Frances – I can now give some information about your watch. From the case number (4-663357) it looks like you have a ‘Cosmostar V2’, which is a woman’s watch with the 6600 automatic movement (it will have both day and date if it’s a 6600). The model name may not be on the dial if it was made for export, since Citizen often did that. This is an interesting movement, with 21 jewels, running at 28,800 beats per hour, so it is a high beat watch. This movement was first made around 1970, so yours is from June 1974 (from first three digits of the the serial number – 40603602). ‘GN-4-S’ is the case type, indicating a water resistant design. I think the model number is actually 64-2075 since the 6600 models were typically designated as ’64-xxxx’.

      The movements in these are great, running at 8 beats per second, which is 28,800 beats per hour. Standard watch movements at that time ran at 18,000 or 21,600 beats per hour. Here’s a post I did about one of these Cosmostars:
      Stephen

      Stephen

      • frances b says:

        Thank you so much for the reply. I really could not find any information regarding the watch since it was pretty old. This watch was given by my late grandfather to my grandmother.

        Thanks again. My apologies for the very late reply. Work has been keeping me from going stuff that I actually want to do.

        Mary Frances A. Bernardo MD, FPCEM

        >

  131. rose says:

    Hi, I was wondering if you can help me determine the year or anything else about this watch I have. It’s a ladies watch. Back reads:

    Citizen
    Base metal YP
    3220-890779SMW
    6121422
    32-8804

    Thank you so much.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Rose, thanks for visiting my blog. I am not very familiar with quartz watches I’m afraid. Your watch has the 3220 moveemnt and I would think it is from 1996. For more detailed information, here is the relevant technical manual: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/3220.pdf
      Stephen

      • Rose says:

        Hi not sure if you mistakenly replied to me instead of Sandra. Can you confirm the information on your reply is for me? Thanks.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Rose, oops, I’m sorry about that. I copied and pasted from an earlier reply to a comment about the same movement, but failed to edit it properly! The info is correct though. I’m sorry I can’t be of more help, but my collection and reference material is about pre-1980 watches and there is little out there about later quartz pieces. Stephen

  132. Andrew says:

    Hi,
    My father left me a few watches when he passed recently and I have been sourcing information on them, I have got all of them but one Citizen and I was wondering if you could help. I was after age mainly, but any info would be great.

    On the back is the following info:
    Citizen Watch Co.
    Base Metal YP
    6031-G03715 Y
    0064146
    Japan (Right Arrow) 12

    Any info would be greatly appreciated, love your work on this blog BTW!!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Andrew, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. Your watch is a quartz model, with a 6031 movement. This movement was produced in the late 1980s / early 1990s, so, using the first three figures in the serial number, yours was made in June 1990. For info, -> 12 indicates where there is a small indent in the case back so it can be prised off, i.e. the 12 o’clock position. Here’s the relevant tech manual which helps if you need a battery etc: http://www.thewatchsite.com/files/Citizen%20Technical%20Manuals/6031.pdf
      Stephen

  133. Alan Cooper says:

    Hi Stephen

    Can you please help me identify my wife’s Citizen watch. This is what appears on the back –
    CITIZEN
    WATCH CO
    BASE METAL TOP
    STAINLESS STEEL BACK
    4 – 101243TA
    0091771
    49-2248
    JAPAN
    GP

    It is a rectangular watch with a black face and gold hands and markings. The glass has gold stripes on it.

    It would fantastic to know something about this watch.

    Thank you so much.

    Alan

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan, thanks for visiting my blog. This is a quartz watch, and I don’t have much reference material on them I’m afraid, other than the very early ones. There’s not much info on the web either, since quartz watches, especially women’s models, are not collected. The numbers on the back are the case number (4-101243), the model number (49-2248) and the serial number (0091771). This last one helps date the watch – using the first three figures, 009 – which tell us that it was made either in September 1980 or 1990. I’m afraid I can’t help more than this.
      Stephen

  134. Will says:

    I have one twice inherited I’m trying to value and i can’t find one line it anywhere. .all the guy at the jewelry store said it’s definitly a nice watch and is quite valuable. .okay just realized this is for comment. .can someone her back to me? Via email?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Will, thanks for visiting my blog. If you post all the detail;s fo your watch here, I can see if I can help. Need to know what’s on the dial, including the dial code if it has one (printed very small at the bottom of the dial) and all the marks on the case back. Stephen

  135. Will says:

    New to blogging. .how do I post pics?

    • sweephand says:

      Sorry Will, but it’s not possible for visitors to post pics direct. You can post a link if you have images stored somewhere like PhotoBucket, or I can email you and you can send them to me and I can post them here. Let me know and I’ll email you if you prefer that. Stephen

  136. awan says:

    Hi , can you plz give me any information about a watch
    On the back is the following info :
    WATER RESISTENT CITIZEN STAINLESS STEEL 6501 4-651642 TA AUTOMATIC 40100356 61-8713
    thank you

  137. John says:

    Hello, I have a Citizen watch i would like some information about. On the face it has Citizen Quartz under the 12 and a CO above 6 (the c goes trough the o) on the back CITIZEN WATCH CO. BASE METAL YP ( i know the YP stands for Gold Plated) numbers 6087-979968 KT and 90200505. Just wondering about the watch and all. Any info would be nice. Thanks.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi John, thanks for visiting my blog. My collection and knowledge is primarily about mechanical movements, but I try to help with quartz too. ‘6087-979968’ would indicate that there is a 6087 movement inside, but I can’t find references to this. Can you please check that this is definitely the number on the case back. Also can you see a small number printed on the dial, just below the 6 o’clock marker. I think the ‘O’ on the dial is actually a ‘Q’, i.e. Citizen Quartz.
      Stephen.

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