The 8200 Movement – Citizen’s Standard Auto

The 21 jewel 8200 automatic movement (21,600 bph) was first produced around 1975, and by the end of the 1970s it had become Citizen’s standard automatic, as the range of mechanical watches was massively reduced as a result of the quartz revolution. Although I include the 8200 in the Movement Table, it was one of the latest movements to be produced in the time frame I have researched, and I don’t (as yet at least) have an example in my collection. However, it is an important movement since it became the Citizen’s base auto for many years, used in a great number of models up to the present day, especially the ‘Eagle 7’ line which rivalled the Seiko 5.  These watches regularly show up for sale, and other than the diver models they don’t make a great deal of money. However, in good condition they should be reliable and accurate watches.

I recently had a question from ‘Kurtnet’ (see here: and he sent me pics of his watch to help check it out – he was worried it might not be authentic.  It looks correct to me, and since it is not marked ‘Eagle 7’ I think this is one of the earlier ones. This one has a serial number starting ‘901’ so I think it’s from January 1979. I thought it would be nice to show the pics here:



Kurtnet’s watch is in decent condition, the case has not been polished and retains its sharp edges. Some scratching on the glass, but it has a nice hand set, and also has Kanji days:

Thanks for the photos Kurtnet 🙂

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88 Responses to The 8200 Movement – Citizen’s Standard Auto

  1. Alan Lewis says:

    Sweephand, I am in a bit quandary. I have just acquired a pristine Citizen Automatic 8200A and I wanted to ask you if you think it is all original or whether it has been reconditioned.
    As can be seen from the pictures at the link

    It is a red face watch with no Dial code only the following text:
    Citizen Automatic 21 Jewels Japan Made
    The back engraving is incomplete in parts although the text in the center is legible and reads:
    4-281080 KT 011012 70 GN-4W-S 71-2591
    The Movement has the following information
    Citizen Watch Co 8200A Unadjusted Japan Twenty One 21 Jewels Along with 7 or ‘V’ at the 7 o clock position.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid your watch has been re-dialled. The movement, case and back are authentic and correct for a Citizen 8200 automatic, but the dial and hands are not correct. The red colour is not an original Citizen colour, and the applied logo is not a proper Citizen one. The original dial for this was either pale gold or black as far as I know. Here’s an example: The back is the same as yours:

      Since the dial has been re-done, or replaced, which suggests the original was not in good shape, it’s possible that the case has been re-plated.

      Sorry this is a negative assessment – I have seen lots of these sort of re-done watches on eBay, I would guess that you didn’t pay too much? Sellers should say what has been done – I know they often don’t of course – but at least a ‘junk’ watch has been saved from the bin. The worry is that the movement has seen much better days although yours looks clean and corrosion free.


  2. Alan Lewis says:

    Thank you for your response, it was very much as I had expected it is also very nice to see what the watch should have looked like. I must admit that the colour of the face was the reason I bought the watch in the first place. May I also say how much I enjoy your blog and informative and passionate descriptions you provide about these wonderful watches; is there any chance for an article on the eagle 7 range in the future?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan,

      thanks for your kind comments, they are much appreciated 🙂 The Eagle 7 range actually falls outside my core collecting area, since those models were made after 1980. As a result I have got little reference material, other than on the 8200 movement itself which was first made around 1975. I’ll certainly consider doing something on the movement, since that is clearly within my time period, and that would have to refer to the Eagle 7’s to be comprehensive.


  3. chris says:

    Hi again Stephen,
    hope you are well.

    Just picking up on the above, I have seen lots of these watches on ebay/Etsy for example. I am finding it difficult to recognise original dials. The pics they provide of the movements look authentic but the dials are all sorts of different colours and designs. Some are outrageous! I know they only go for small money so not losing out much but it would be nice to be able to recognise new dials from old (any model not just the Eagle 7’s). have you any tips?

    many thanks

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Chris, all good here thanks, hope the same goes for you. It can indeed be difficult to identify correct models / dials. Citizen produced some colourful dials and unusual designs themselves, so not all of the weirder ones are are necessarily re-dials/re-paints. However, there are many examples on eBay with re-painted dials – mostly these seem to have been done in India, where I guess people are rescuing watches where the original dials are in poor condition. And to be fair at least some sellers say that the dial is re-painted in the description. The cases and movements are probably original, although sometimes the cases are heavily polished. Citizen made a lot of the 8200 models, most commonly the ‘Eagle 7’ ones (but as you say not always) in the 1980s and 1990s. I don’t have original catalogs for the vast majority of these so it is a question of studying the dial and coming to a conclusion about it, using the case and model numbers to see if another example can be found. Some re-painted dials are obvious, since their quality is not good enough to be original, e.g. less than fine printing, crudely cut applied logos and sometimes odd emblems, whilst some have ‘Citizen’ applied in what looks rather like solder. These can be easily discounted as original, but others are less easy.

      First off I would advise doing a search for other examples, using the case and model numbers – if you can find others then they can at least be compared. When examining a dial, look for a dial code near the 6 o’clock marker – if that is missing then it’s likely to be a re-paint, or at least touched up round the edge. It may be difficult to see in a photo, so ask the seller to confirm whether a code is there. Usually, for an 8200 model, the dial code will start with ‘8200’ or be in the form of ‘6-82XXXX’. Also, compare the quality of the dial printing and logos / emblems with other ones which are known to be original – re-paints are likely to be coarser than original quality.

      After that, if you’re not sure about a piece, I am quite happy to take a look and see what I can find out / conclude about originality or otherwise.


  4. Nestor OSorio says:

    Hi, am searching information about a Citizien that i found in my house, but i did not foun much information, I saw the numer 8200 (Japan 8200) and google showed me this link. The watch is old as the movement.
    The watch has the following numbers and codes.
    CITIZIEN watch co. 4-062787 SMT 9056704C GN-4-S 71-1705 JAPAN G.P
    what information can you give me about the watch?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Nestor, thank you for visiting my blog – I am sorry for my late reply, but I’ve had to replace my computer this week and going from WinXP to 8.1 has been a bit of a challenge 😉

      The information from the case back on your watch indicates it is one of the Eagle 7 models, which use the 8200 automatic movement. Although this movement was first produced in 1976, the Eagle 7 range appeared in the 1980s and was made right through the 1990s. From the style of the case back numbers I would say that the first three parts of the serial number on yours – 9056704 – give a production date of May 1989. The other numbers are the case number (4-062787) and the model number (71-1705). ‘GN-4-S’ is the case type code, indicating a water resistant crystal and screw-on back.


  5. Fredrik says:

    Many thanks for informative blog.
    I just bought a Citizen 71-2639 with a 8200A movement. Information on the internet indicates it is a 7 Eagle but there is no such logo on the watch. Is it a re-paint?

    • sweephand says:

      H Fredrik, thanks for visiting my blog. It is a repainted dial, usually the ones like this have been re-done in India. I guess that the original dial was badly worn / damaged so it’s a way of rescuing the case and movement. What’s happened to the second hand? it seems to have gone AWOL!


  6. Fredrik says:

    Thanks for the reply. I will bring this up with the seller. I now have a small collection of vintage Citizens…4 in total but as I am very happy with the first three ones there will be more to come.

  7. Fredrik says:

    A Parawater 21j 63-4093 with a blue shimmering dial…from 1972…a Simpson?
    An Automatic 17j parawater 62-8018…1971 it seems. Black dial.
    A CCP 63-6517 with a silver bullseye dial. Can not figure out the year but around 1970.
    Will get back with pics.

  8. Jeff Rollins says:

    Hi, I own a Citizen automatic 21 Jewels. I bought it from one of those India shops on Ebay. It has a nice black face with gold index hour markers. It has served me well for the past year. Today, I dropped it on the wood floor and guess what, it stopped. Is it worth rescuing? The back is labeled Citizen Watch Co. Water Resist Stainless 4-824083K Serial 30103042 GN-4-S Japan.
    The front says Japan P-820 O-S92844KA
    I like the look and feel of it. Hope it is not a lost cause.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jeff, thanks for visiting my blog. Sorry to hear about the accident to the watch. The movement in yours is the 8200 automatic which is a reliable ‘workhorse’ that can often be very accurate. The dilemma you’ll have is whether a repair is worth the expense, compared to finding a replacement movement. These aren’t expensive pieces so they an be picked up cheaply, and that may be a more economic route for a ‘donor’ watch than paying for a repair – searching eBay with ‘Citizen 21 jewels’ should find some. If you have a local watchmaker (not a jewellers) who can take a look and give you a quote for repair or movement transplant (if you aren’t able to do it yourself) then you’ll be in a better position to decide.


  9. Alastair Smyth says:

    I have two Citizen date hand wind watches, one with a 2510 movement and the other with a 2510A movement. These movements are of quite a different design to the other hand winders I have seen. Do you have any information about them as when I google “Citizen 2510 movement ” the search produces details for a quartz movement.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alastair, thanks for visiting my blog. The 25xx movements were produced from 1972 to around 1980. They were a more basic design than Citizen’s other hand winders, so they could offer them at an affordable price. Perhaps because they weren’t designed for longevity, not many examples are seen. A bit more info is on page 10 of the Movement Table:

      Are case backs marked in the usual way? i.e. do they have case and model numbers and a serial number? If they have a conventional serial number we can identify the production date.


      • Alastair Smyth says:

        Thanks for your comments .The case back markings are

        4-100177 SMH
        4-100042 HM
        Stainless Steel

        Thanks for you blog I have been watching for a few months and have learned a lot
        Keep up the good work

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Alastair, thanks for the info – unfortunately no serial numbers, so exact dates of production can’t be determined, although I wonder if the ’74’ on the second one refers to 1974. Thanks for your kind comments and good to hear you are following the blog 🙂


  10. Derek says:

    I have enjoyed reading your blogs. I am trying to find out more information on a Citizen 21 Jewel watch that I purchased from ebay. The movement is 8200A and back markings are:

    Citizen Watch Co
    Water Resistant
    4-R12683 RC
    I assume this is a redialed watch but any information you have would be greatly appreciated.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Derek, thanks for visiting my blog and it’s good to hear you have enjoyed it. You’re right that your watch has been re-dialled – was it from India? The sellers there often repaint dials, presumably because the originals have got badly faded / corroded. The 8200 auto movement was first made in 1976 and became Citizen’s workhorse mechanical watch for many years. It is a sound and reliable movement, and in good condition will run pretty accurately. It can be hand wound as well, which is handy to get it going and a few turns is recommended to give best performance – see this manual:

      The case number on yours – 4-R12683 – and the six figure serial number suggest to me that it is not one of the early models, so I would think it is from February 1988 (from the first two digits of the number – ’82’). ‘GN-4W-S’ is the case type code, indicating a water resistant design with screw on back.


  11. dedens says:

    Thank you for the quick response. I assumed it was a redial as I purchased the watch from India. The redial doesn’t bother me as I like the watch for what it is. I was hoping it was a little older, just for the cool factor. Any idea as to what the original dial color could have been? I realize there is no way to tell for sure.

  12. marvin says:

    Good morning, Stephen. Glad I stumbled upon your terrific blog.
    I was about to jump on a couple of great looking vintage Citizens until I realized (thx to you) that they are repainted dials, new or buffed dial windows, and condition-unknown guts. The seller must be buying the old watches by the barrel, in order to re-dial, polish, re-strap, and sell these for 20 USD shipped!
    Ebay is often “too good to be true”.
    Great looking watches though! At least by the sales photos that don’t show the case backs. Are they worth it in your opinion, since they are not actually “vintage”? I think new /newer Eagle 7’s can be had for <$100.
    Thanks, Stephen. I have a couple other questions for another day.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Marvin, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment.

      There are a lot of these re-dialled watches sold out of India. I guess that they are rescuing beat up / worn out watches that would otherwise be scrapped. And as long as you know what you are buying that is fair enough since the asking price is low, and this seller doesn’t hide the fact that they have been re-dialled etc. BUT I also notice that they are described as having 17 jewels, and the 8200 automatic was a 21 jewel model, so this is a bit odd. May be an error by the seller, but it rings an alarm bell, especially since there are no photos of the movement or case back.

      As a collector and therefore a bit of a purist (or nerd!!) I couldn’t get to like these, but I do understand that if they work, even for a while, $20 is not a bad deal – providing they have the correct movement and you aren’t kidded into buying something you think is original.


  13. GC says:

    Blessed morning. I found this on eBay too. Could you see from the photo that this is the original colour? As for the price, I am willing to try it out. Love the design.

  14. Bob Dobalina says:

    My friend and i struggle to get info on a 8200 21 jewel,

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Bob, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m travelling at the moment so can’t do a full reply. Should be able to comment in a couple of days.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Bob, apologies for the late reply – you have one of the early models using the 8200 automatic movement. This movement was first made in 1976, and your model number (71-0423) is listed in my 1977 case parts catalog. The date of yours is later than this though since the serial number (10601412) gives a date (from the first three figures) of June 1981. 4-164024 is the case number which would have helped a watchmaker order parts when doing a service, and ‘GN-4’ is the case type, showing it is a water resistant type with a screw on case back. Some more info on the movement is here:


      • Bob Dobalina says:

        Thank you for your reply , Do they hold any value in their original Condition i cant seem to find on like it

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Bob – you’re welcome. I’m afraid the 8200 models don’t have any great value, even in original and good condition. This movement was used for over 30 years so there are many on the second hand market, and although a sound and reliable movement they are not ‘high end’ so are not so attractive to collectors and others.


  15. exxotik says:

    Hello i found your website and found it very interesting i really like it, you definitly are a CITIZEN expert !

    I dont want to bother you but i’ve seen everybody is asking you info about watches they so i thought you could help me learn more about this watch:

    What can you tell me about this ? there’s a picture of the back with serial etc.. And it is stated in the description also (dial model number too).

    Regards, Jerome

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jerome, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid I don’t know too much about this watch, other than it has the 8200 automatic movement in it that Citizen used over many years. It is more recent than the time period I know best – the earliest it could be is November 1987, but it could possibly 1997. I would suggest you look for other examples of the same model to check that it appears all correct.


  16. Richard says:

    I have found a citizen 21 jewels automatic with glas on both sides by cleaning up downstars. The number is 8200-r01860 Rw
    or p-8200-r09141-ky , i don’t know which is the relevant one.
    I would be very thankful , for any informations und an idea for the price i can sell it.
    Nice greatings from germany,

  17. mike says:

    Hello, sorry If this is a double post. again love this page and thank you for all that you do!!!
    Need info on this beautiful piece.
    fist line
    4-638909 space k
    the 6 could also be a 0
    second line
    Thank you so much in advance

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mike – thanks for visiting my blog and for you kind comment. I’m not finding any reference to case numbers 4-638909 or 4-038909 I’m afraid. Can you post a link to a photo? If not can you please describe what’s on the face of the dial, and particularly can you see a dial code, in small print at the very bottom of the dial, usually under the 6 o’clock marker. Assuming this is an 8200 automatic, the serial number – 631235 – is not one of the early ones, which would usually have 8 digits, so it’s likely to be from 1986 or even 1996. The 8200 was produced for over 30 years so dating them can be tricky. 1990s models tend to have a different type of case number though, so 1986 is more likely in my opinion. The case type code will actually be GN-4-W-s, which denotes a water resistant case and crystal with a screw down back.


  18. jarwin says:

    Hi ser!! My uncle gave me a citizen 7eagle 21jewels before he died black face, gold plated i dont have idea if it is oreginal one!!it is 8200-R02092 RC…850999 GN-4w-S!!wish you give me a ideas!!

  19. Peter Carnelli says:

    I have a Citizen model 4-281080-KT and noted water on the inside of the crystal after a week or so of receiving it. As with all my autos I shower with it on. I tinker with these watches so I opened it up and noticed no gasket at all. My question is did this model come with a gasket and if so can you direct me to where I can buy a generic replacement. I mention attaining a generic because Citizen tells me that it is non-US watch so they offer no parts or specifications to assist me.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Peter, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch should certainly have a case back gasket. The original part number is 393-0300. I’m afraid I don’t know where to go for a generic replacement, but I would have thought a decent watch guy would be able to find something suitable. The usual advice about vintage watches is not to shower or swim with them even when they have got the gaskets in place.

  20. david ona says:

    Hi sweephand

    I recently stumbled on a functional citizen watch. The cover had “citizen watch co 4-062019 SMT 80442709 GN-4-S 71-0920 Japan GP. The movement has “citizen watch co 8200A unadjusted twenty-one 21 jewels” written. Please I would like to know if its genuine and date of manufacture if possible.


    • sweephand says:

      Hi David – the case back info all looks correct, and the model number (4-062019) is an authentic one. So it sounds it all seems correct. The production date is not straightforward since the 8200 movement was in production for well over 30 years. The earliest it could be is April 1978, but it could be April 1988. Can you tell me what is on the dial, since this might help pin the production date down? Is there a dial code below the 6 o’clock marker? Stephen

  21. Mark says:

    Hi, I am reading your forum with interest and am sat here hoping you can advise me like you have helpfully done to many others.
    I have in my hand what I think is an 8200 automatic. Here’s some info.
    Inside the circular tract it say
    All stainless steel
    Water resistant

    Then inside the track in this order:-)
    4-822111 TA

    It’s 21 Jewel, with a green face with the day in two different languages. I guess that might be English and Japanese?

    The strap is leather it shows little wear so I’m assuming that’s been replaced.
    Can you tell me anything useful please?

  22. Dumi says:

    Hi! May someone please help me to tell, if this watch i got is a real citizen or a fake one ?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Dumi, thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for my slow reply. I’m afraid I don’t know the quartz models too well, so I can’t advise for sure whether it is real or fake. Stephen

  23. Marzena says:

    Hi. I’m looking some info about citizen watch. I been looking everywhere and only on your blog I could find some information.
    On front under 6 is serial number P-8200-RO9132-KY
    On the back is going in order
    Citizen watch co.
    Water resist
    Base metal to
    4-RO2092 RC

    Can you give me any more info about it please and thank you Marzena

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Marzena, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is one of the ‘Eagle 7’ models, using Citizen’s 8200 automatic movement. This movement was first made around 1976, and was in production for over 30 years, so dating them can be difficult. The Eagle 7 models first appeared around 1980, and were made for a long time. The style of the case number – 4-RO2092 – suggests to me that it is not one of the earlier ones, so I think it is from December 1992 (see the first three figures in the serial number). ‘GN-4W-S’ is the case type code and indicates that it is a water resistant type with a screw down back. If you search this blog with ‘8200’ you can find more examples and a bit more information. Stephen

  24. Tom Dunn says:

    Hi Sweep, I love the size and look of these Citizens…so comfy on the wrist
    I just got in an almost NOS example of an Eagle 7 with a beautiful deep blue dial
    #s are: 4-824008 K
    It looks more like an 50s style watch which would make it born in August, 1983
    Do you think it could be 1993, or even 2003?
    Any more clues to tell year of mfg on these late model Eagle 7s?


    • sweephand says:

      Hi Tom, thanks for visiting my blog. It’s difficult to be sure about production dates since the 8200 movement was in production for well over 30 years, and the Eagle 7’s had a long production run too. But there are a couple of stylistic clues to help – first, the 8 figure serial number is more typical of earlier models – later ones were typically six figure, sometimes including a letter. Second, the case number – 4-824008 – is also typical of earlier models, since it includes the ’82’ movement reference. So I’d say this one is from 1983.

      • Tom Dunn says:

        Stephen; I would post a pic on here if I knew where to do so, but I think you’re right on the date
        It LOOKS like an 80s piece, it’s 95%+ condition. Definitely a keeper. These little things get me more excited than a rolex would. Now to find a similiar condition Bull Head, which wont be easy. Thanks!

  25. Tom Dunn says:

    Meant to say EIGHTIES style watch, sorry

  26. Anthony says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I recently got an Eagle 7 with the following serials at the caseback: 4-R11547 RC 8N0177 GN-4W-S. I’d like to know more about this variant like year released, or anything noteworthy. I’m looking on expanding my Citizen collection especially the Eagle 7s Thanks in advance!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Anthony. Other than what you can find here about the 8200 movement, I would add that this model is a later one – this is based on the style of the case number, which contains the letter ‘R’. Earlier models are all numbers. The same applies to the serial number, which also contains a letter and is six digits long. Earlier serial numbers are all numerical and 8 digits long, maybe 7 sometimes. So I would think that this one is from November 1998.

      • Anthony says:

        Wow thanks for that info Stephen! I never thought this model would be from the late 90’s. Would you know if Eagle 7’s are still in production? I’ve read somewhere that they’re now exclusive in the Asian market and other blogs stated they’re not being produced anymore, new pieces in jewelers and watch retail outlets are possibly the last of the series. Anyway here’s the exact watch I’m talking about, someone wrote about it in their blog: I really love this watch, from its look, size, and of course its heritage. I’m looking forward in acquiring more Eagle 7’s!


        • sweephand says:

          I’m afraid I don’t know whether Eagle 7’s are still in production, or when Citizen ceased production if not. In good condition they are reliable watches and can be very accurate. Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Slin, thanks for your kind comment. I think that watch has been re-dialled. The outer ring looks wrong, seems to be used just to fill the gap. Also, the applied Citizen logo looks typical of re-dials to me. Stephen

      • Slin says:

        Thanks for this info! Now I look differant at bying Citizen’s because of your info.
        I try to look at the 6 o’clock position and then determine if it”s legit and the caseback, I already bought one wich said “Japan Made” at the 6 o’clock.
        Just starting collecting so these are helpfull thins to look at.Thanks!!

  27. Slin says:

    Hi Sweephand,

    Further I like to know how I can send pictures towards you(via email?) about a couple Citizen’s parawater i’ve bougt recently. Two parawaters with waterproof on the front en parawater on the caseback.


  28. Tom says:

    Slin; What to look for are the numbers BELOW the six…the redone dial ones never have that they simply say nothing or Japan made You will find a lot of redials on ebay just take the time to look closely below six and you’ll weed out the redos…Good Luck!

    • Slin says:

      Hi Tom,

      Yes, thanks! Sometimes it is hard to see the numbers below 6 o’clock on the internet.

      Greetings from Holland..

      • sweephand says:

        Good luck Slin – don’t hesitate to ask here if you want to check anything out before you buy. Stephen

        • Slin says:

          Thanks! I will ask but the watches I look for are not that expensive and somethimes I take a chance hoping it will turn out nice;), with this info of your blog I can protect myself even more.

          By the way, did you receive my photos? It went a little wrong with my email client;)

          Especially the one with the silver dial I’m curious about…love that watch and I even don’t care if it is not real:).I paid E35 for it and I wear it regularly.

          The numbers of this one on the back are:


          If I’m not wrong this watch is from March 1970?

          Correct me please if I am wrong and pardon my english…

          Best regards

          • sweephand says:

            I got your emails, thanks, although the pics aren’t opening too happily tonight so I’ll get comments to you on all of them, probably be tomorrow. As for the silver dial one, it’s fine – it is indeed from March 1970, and has the 1810 ‘Homer’ date movement. Your English is fine too 🙂 Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      Good advice Tom 🙂

      • Tom says:

        Guys now is the time to pick up a few choice ones…cheap. Citizens are very underappreciated watches. I got a 1983 Eagle 7 that’s almost NOS with a beautiful deep blue dial gives me more satisfaction to admire and wear it than does my Rolex! Especially when I think of how little I actually paid…

        • marvin says:

          Tom, where did you find the NOS Eagle 7?

          I love these old Citizen autos, but the vast majority of what I see on ebay is repainted trash from India. Last year I even bought one from a US dealer, and it was beautiful, until a couple of dial markers fell off! The dealer said she didn’t know (?) it was an Indian refurb.

          Btw, I’ve picked up a few of the redialed pieces, knowingly, and accordingly paid very little for them.

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