Citizen’s Vintage Mechanical Divers, 1962 to 1980


Citizen produced a range of divers in their 1960s and 1970s line-up. A few are relatively well known, but others are not and are rarely seen. This page brings them all together in one place as a reference point. Although I’ve tried to make it as comprehensive as possible, there is little information available elsewhere so I regard it as ‘work in progress’. I hope information can be added later, or errors corrected, with the help of fellow collectors so it as complete as possible. I indicate in the article with a ‘?’ (sometimes with notes as well) where I am not entirely sure about the data I’ve gathered, and I welcome any comments about the information so it can be developed and firmed up over time.

Although this page covers Citizen’s mechanical divers, I appreciate that they also produced some excellent quartz models in the late 1970s, most notably the 600m rated Crystron. They are not included here, at least for the time being, since I have not got the necessary reference material.

I have included dates against each movement number, which is the date I understand the movement was first produced, but this may not be the year when the diver model using that movement was introduced. I believe it’s likely that some divers would not have been brought to the market in the same year the movement was first produced. This is an area of information that I hope can be  clarified in the future.

The divers are grouped by depth rating (starting at 100 meters), and I have included only models which can be described as ‘true’ divers, i.e. they have a moveable external or internal bezel, and lumed hands and markers which can be used under water to time a dive.  All the divers are automatics.

Case backs are often stamped with the case type in the usual way, e.g. ‘GN-4-S’. However, a number of the models are stamped with an alternative marking for a screw down water proof type, namely ‘OR-O’. This marking is usually seen on divers, but not exclusively so.

Where possible I have credited images I’ve saved from the internet, but many I’m afraid I am unable to credit. I wish to generally acknowledge and credit the owners of these images here, and if you are the owner please let me know, via the ‘comment’ facility, so I can either credit them fully or remove them if you wish. I have used the images only to provide supporting information for this page.

If you have good/better images of any of the models, or indeed any I have missed, and you are happy to let me use them on this page (with acknowledgement of course) please let me know.

Depth Rating: 100 meters

Citizen’s 100m divers are part of the Seven Star range, and two movements were used. The first is the 5270 movement with 21 or 23 jewels, first launched in 1965. This is a non-hacking, hand wind-able calibre running at 18,000 beats per hour (bph). Two case types are used,  one a conventional type with external bezel (I believe this is bi-directional) and screw down crown, the other a twin crown type with internal rotating bezel turned by a second crown. NB: I have previously referred to this model as a ‘compressor’ model – however I am now aware that this is not correct, so I have edited this page to reflect that and refer to it as a ‘twin crown’ model. See this post for more informationhttps://sweep-hand.org/2014/05/01/citizens-so-called-compressor-diver/

The second movement is the 7270 with 21 jewels, a calibre used in the Seven Star V2 range and introduced in 1969, with hand-winding, and running at 21,600 bph. Only models with an external bezel were made with this movement.

Dials and case backs on the Seven Star divers are marked ‘Parawater’ or ‘Waterproof’ (export models?) since they precede the early 1970s when manufacturers had to change to water ‘resistant’.

The Seven Star divers were made with a range of dial colours – black, silver, blue, orange and red, and all had day and date complications (see image galleries). Here are the models in the range:

5270 (21 and 23 jewels): Model Number: 61-5773 / Case Number:  APSS 52904-Y (23j) or 4-520858 Y (23j, and 21j, export ‘proof’ model)

 

‘Proof’ Export Example, with 21 jewels (? original hands):

The orange dialled version of the export ‘waterproof’ model, with many thanks to Vlad for contributing photos of his watch:

euro1255_zpst5wenkrd

euro1257_zpslemvazyl

euro1252_zpsae3sbazk

5270 (21 jewels):  Twin Crowns – Case Number: APSS 2812-Y or 4-520343 Y

   

There was also a version of this model, maybe only an export version, that had a straoght hour hand, rather than the ‘Mercedes’ type. At the moment this image, from a German brochure (with credit to ‘Axel’ on the old SCWF site) is the only one I have seen:

5270 (21 jewels): Twin Crowns – Case Number: 4-521315 Y, Marked ‘Deluxe’ with separate date and day windows, Crowns at 3 & 4 o’clock

5270 (21 jewels): Twin Crowns  Case Number:  4-520017 Y, Marked ‘Deluxe’ with separate date and day windows, Crowns at 2 and 4 o’clock

7270 (21 jewels): Model Number: 67-5776 / Case Number: 4-720521 Y & 4-721641 Y

(above image courtesy of Steve Oliverio)

(above image courtesy of Steve Oliverio)

(above image courtesy of ‘Techca’)

The Dandy Seven diver – this is a fascinating discovery, a model I had not seen before in any form (for sale, in catalogs or adverts), but one example has been put up for sale on Yahoo Japan. It appears to me to be a genuine model, since the seller posted pictures including the original manual which showed instructions for using the external bezel. This example appears to be ‘NOS’, on its original bracelet with tags and box. The external bezel appears to be unique to this model, with a large circular lume pip not placed within a steel triangle.

The Dandy Seven was a range of more colourful designs from the very end of the 1960s aimed at younger buyers. They used a 27 jewel movement from the ’52’ family (which included the much better known Crystal Seven range). My own example has a 5204 movement, so at this stage I am assuming this is used in the diver (day and date windows are laid out the same) but I add a ‘?’ since I cannot verify that and there were other 52 movement designations that had 27 jewels:

5204? (27 jewels) Dandy Seven: Model Number: None / Case Number: 4-520688 Y

 Depth Rating: 120 meters

Just one model was made with this depth rating – a Jet Auto Dater – using Citizen’s earlier 1120 automatic movement with its circular geared rotor, 19 jewels and date only complication, running at 18,000 bph. Although this was first produced in 1962 it’s probably unlikely that this model was produced as early as that – unfortunately no serial numbers are stamped on the case backs, so this is a mystery still to be solved.

I have found examples only of black dialled models with external bezel – with two types of bezel (?) and two types of hands (?)  – I’ve not been able to fully authenticate these variations but my judgement at this stage is that they are original types.

1120 (19 jewels): Jet Auto Dater – Case Number: ADRS 51301-DA

Other hand set – ? original second hand

 

Depth Rating: 150 meters

The 150 meter models are Citizen’s largest diver group. For the most part using an almost standard design, they used 6 movements or their derivatives between the mid-1960s through to the early 1980s. The first two models in the listing below – the ‘Crystal Date’ and the high grade ‘Super Auto Dater Professional’ are particularly rare, as is the high-beat 7200 model.

The overall design is the archetypal hefty steel case with black dial and external bi-directional black bezel and, with one exception, large screw down crown. In all but two models the hour hand is the ‘Mercedes’ type (see also notes for each model below). Two models have day as well as date complications, and two have special case backs.

There are several small variations to the bezels and inserts, which I’m not yet fully familiar with, so I hope to include information on that at a later date. With thanks also to Alex for information on hand sets.

1150 (39 jewels) Super Auto Date Professional: Case Number: SADS 52801-Y / 18,000bph / Date Complication / Movement first produced in 1963

Note this is a one-piece case – indicated by an encircled ‘X’  on the back:

Here’s an example of the movement in a different model:

5410 (33 jewels) Crystal Date: Case Number AUDS 52802-Y / 18,000bph / Date Complication / Special Case Back / Movement first produced in 1968

5401 (21 jewels): Model Number: B52806 (export version of the 62-5370, see below) / 18,000bph / Date Complication / Special Case Back, with no serial number / Long Hands / Ball at end of second hand / No lume to right of date /Movement first produced in 1968 (image by ‘1386Paul’):

The special case back has no serial number:

Following image by ‘1386Paul’:

5401 (21 jewels): Model Number: 62-5370 (other than case back, same as B52806 –  see above) / Case Number: 4-540115Y / 18,000bph / Date Complication (sometimes red print?) / Long hands / Ball at end of second hand (note: plain steel hand with ‘spear’ shaped short end also offered on 4-540115 – see catalog pic) / No lume to right of date / Movement first produced in 1968

 

7200 (24 jewels): Case Number: 4-722710 Y / 28,800bph / Day & Date Complications / Long hands / Ball at end of second hand / High-beat, with fine adjuster on balance (as in ‘Leopard’ range  / Movement first produced in 1970

7470 (21 jewels): Model Number: 68-5372 / Case Number: 4-740131 Y / 21,600 bph / Date Complication /Long hands / Ball at end of second hand / No lume to right of date / Movement first produced in 1971(?)

6000 (21 jewels): Model Number: 62-6198 / Case Number: 4-600851 Y / 21,600 bph / Date Complication / Short hands / Ball at end of second hand / Red date print / Movement first produced in 1971 / Movement stamped ‘6001’

Known as a ‘Challenge Diver‘, at least this model and the 52-0110 were called Challenge Divers, echoing the Challenge Timer moniker given to Citizen’s 1970s mechanical chronographs:

ChallengeDiverBox

Note the stamped area is smaller on the earlier case back (left) leaving a slightly wider margin than the later one (right) – images courtesy of ‘1386Paul’ :

  

The third type of back clearly shows the calibre number (image by ‘Scoobadoo’):

In the spirit of ‘I hope information can be added later, or errors corrected, with the help of fellow collectors so it as complete as possible‘ (see the introductory paragraph at the top of the page) I recently added comments and an image of a 62-6198 with an orange dial and blue bezel provided by ‘1386paul’ – however, ‘Mikko’, who is also a Citizen diver collector, kindly provided some detailed comments about this along with other interesting material, with excellent photos. I have now included this information at the end of the next section on the 52-0110 models since it covers them and the 62-6198.

8210 (21 jewels): Model Number: 52-0110 / Case Number: 4-820789 Y / 21,600 bph / Date complication (some may have red date print?) / Short hands / Ball not quite at end of second hand /  Movement first produced in 1977 (?) – also produced with blue and orange dials

One of citizen’s ‘Challenge Diver’ range – see this link: http://tokeibakai.exblog.jp/17252830/  (thanks to Mikko for finding this)

Case back image courtesy of ‘Galpo’:

The 8210 movement rotates in one direction only (image by ‘Galpo’):

Here is the orange dialled model (pic by ‘1386paul’):

And here is an example of the blue dial – please note: the bezel insert is not correct (it’s from a Seiko diver), image from the internet via ‘1386paul’:

———————————————————————————————————-

Contributions from 1386paul (Paul) and Mikko:  I include here the information and comments I’ve received from these two diver collectors, with many thanks to them for taking the time to let me have information and their observations. For clarity, Mikko’s input is italicised.

62-6198 Orange Dial with Blue bezel? 

Paul sent me this image of a 62-6198 with orange dial (not his watch, pic is from the internet):

62-6198OrangeDialBlueBezel

The case is clearly a 62-6198, and Paul is happy that the dial is original to this piece. However, Mikko suggests that the dial is more likely from a 52-0110:

I’m 99% sure that this example of an orange dialled Citizen is actually the rather rare orange dialled 52-0110 with original bezel from a 62-6198. There are several examples for comparison on the internet. Dial details are identical to the black 52-0110 variant I show later in my commentary. Paul’s example also has a black date disk, and a second hand from a 52-0110. 

Paul tells me he has examples of the 62-6198 in his collection with black printed date wheels, and with the 52-0110 second hand.

I have looked as closely as I can at this dial and Mikko’s images and agree that the design fits the 52-0110 (see his pics below) so, at this stage at least, I cannot say that this example is a bona-fide orange dialled 62-6198. I have not yet been able to find another example of an orange dialled 62-6198, which is what we need to find to pin this one down! Ideally original catalogs or adverts are what we need to authenticate both the dial and hand designs. And here’s an image from Martin (‘Martback’) of his orange 52-0110 which dial-wise appears to identical to the one above (thanks Martin), with dial code of 8210-825095:

5210 Orange

As to the bezel, it clearly looks to be blue in the image, and Paul believes that this was the original colour. Mikko on the other hand is sceptical, and suggests ‘blue’ may be the result of UV light:

I’m still highly doubtful about the existence of a blue bezel in any of the “basic” 1970s divers. I have seen many examples which at first glance appear to be blue, however my personal opinion is that blue colour is caused by UV fading. Here is one of the most extreme examples I have found ( http://www.watchmeandyou.com/2011/02/citizen-diver-52-0110.html ).  In this case even the dial has turned blue. 

So again, there is enough doubt for me about the blue bezel that I need to find an original image, say from a catalog or advert, before I can confimr it is an authentic colour.

On the subject of bezels, here are some very helpful macro images of lume pips, courtesy of Mikko:

Original bezel from 52-0110:

52-0110lumepip

Original bezel from 62-6198:

62-6198lumepip

Reproduction bezel based on 62-6198 specifications:

62-6198reprolumepip

The lume pip of both original bezels is covered with a very thin layer of glass to avoid wearing of the lume material. There is always a black ring around the lume pip in original ones. Bogdan’s page shows more details how to identify a bezel’s authenticity:

http://vintagecitizenwatches.com/2014/07/26/citizen-150m-diver-bezel-original-vs-fake/

Mikko has also provided some invaluable further information about dials:

Dial variants of the black 52-0110

There are two black dial variants of 52-0110 that I know of. My examples are fully original including crystals. Crystals have some scratches which causes some issues with the quality of the photos

Dial code: 8210 820719-6

My quess (I need to collect more evidence) is that this is the first version of the 52-0110 as the dial details and how it is constructed are quite similar to older Citizen divers (see later). I think the dials have been built in the following way:

Lume pips and Citizen logo are part of the dial (welded or stamped) dial is painted Surface of the lume pip frames and and Citizen logo are polished to remove the paintlume is applied

Here are some photos of the watch and the details (I have one of these from 1977):

52-0110BlackA

52-0110BlackAdetail

8210 820719-6: Date ring frame and lume pip frame are connected. Again, blending to the rest of the dial.

52-0110BlackAdate

Dial code: 8210 824391 KA

This dial design appears to be similar to the orange dial version of the 52-0110. My theory is that Citizen changed the dial manufacturing technique at some point where lume pips and logo are separately applied after the dial has been been painted. I believe the dial construction is as follows:

Dial is painted lume pips are lumed and installed individually using rivets(??) Citizen logo and date frame are applied with rivets(??). Resulting look is crisper than in the other dial version as details look like they are “floating” on the dial surface. Down side is that quality of the black dial paint is not as good as in other versions and these dials seems to fade over time.

Some photos of the watch and the details (I have two of these from 1977 and 1978):

52-0110BlackB

Dial code: 8210 824391 KA: Letters in the Citizen logo are connected and logo is separately applied. Lume pips are not a fixed part of the dial and have razor sharp edges:

52-0110BlackBdetail

Dial code: 8210 824391 KA: the date frame is not connected to the lume pip and the lume pip is only partly framed. Both of these have been applied separately:

52-0110BlackBdate

Some additions to 62-6198 variants

This case back variant…..

62-6198BackA

….has “WATER RESISTANT” text in the dial:

62-6198BackAtext

Whereas this case back variant….

62-6198BackB

…..is missing the “WATER RESISTANT” text:

62-6198BackBtext

I have four (3 x 1974, 1 x 1975) 62-6198’s without the “WATER RESISTANT” text and two (2 x 1976) with the text and they all have same dial code: JAPAN 6000-602231-S

And finally two detailed photos of one of my 62-6198’s:

62-6198DialLogoA

62-6198DialLogoADate

———————————————————————————————————-

Many thanks to Paul & Mikko for their contributions to this page – their comments and excellent photographs provide invaluable reference material.

———————————————————————————————————-

8200 (21 jewels): Model Number: 51-2273 / Case Number: 4-822145 Y / 21,600 bph / Date Complication / ‘Spade’ hands / Rectangular lume spot just over half way along second hand / Round intermediate hour markers / Small crown

(image by PeteW)

Depth Rating: 200 meters

Possibly Citizen’s first diver, using the 1120 ‘Jet’ movement in 21 jewel form (first produced in 1962) this 200 meter rated model was known as the ‘Skin Diver’. This is a very rare piece. It appears to have been made with black or silver dials and an external bezel. The dial is marked ‘AUTO DATER’, with a specially engraved back, with no serial number to help date it. ‘KK’ a reader of this blog, owns one of these and kindly offered use of his pictures. With enormous gratitude and full credit to KK, I have now included his images, along with a scan from the relevant ‘museum’ book of domestic Japanese watches and the only other image I have so far of the back, from a silver dialled model, which is missing its bezel. The case is 37.5mm wide, excluding crown, and the crown is push/pull, not screw down.

1120 (21 jewels): ‘Skin Diver’ Auto Dater

Above four images with thanks to ‘KK’ – see also this post: https://sweep-hand.org/2013/03/31/citizens-vintage-200m-diver-the-21-jewel-skin-diver/

(above image courtesy of ‘kuma-kun’)

Depth Rating: 500 meters

Citizen’s highest grade diver, and an exceptionally rare piece, is the Chrono Master 500 meter diver. Tuned to Chronometer standard, as indicated on the dial, this uses the 33 jewel 5420* movement and was first produced in 1971. With date only complication, and a unique minute hand the movement runs at 18,000 bph. The second hand is also unique to this model, with a square lume pip close to the end of the hand.

The special case back features the Chrono master eagle emblem – I’m not sure whether it is in in the form of a medallion (as would normally be the case with standard Chrono Masters) or engraved (which may be more suitable on a diver?).

5420* (33 jewels): Chrono Master Chronometer

* Note: my reference material for this movement gives the movement number as ‘5420’ – see image gallery. I am not sure that this is correct – it may be a mis-print, since the standard 33 jewel date only Chrono Master Chronometer is the 5240

  

 

346 Responses to Citizen’s Vintage Mechanical Divers, 1962 to 1980

  1. jason_recliner says:

    Superb article – added to favourites. Thanks a lot!

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks 🙂 I hope I can improve it over time as people provide more info

      Stephen

      • Rui Baptista says:

        hello, can you please help me identify my watch?
        vintage Citizen Promaster WR100 red dial and red bracelet
        how do i post a photo?

        • sweephand says:

          Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. I’m afraid it’s not possible for visitors to post pictures directly here – if you can upload them to something like Photobucket than you can post a link, or I can e-mail you and you could send them to me for me to post. I’m not sure how much I can help since the Promaster watches are more recent than the vintage mechanical watches I know. Please let me know if you want me to e-mail you,

          Stephen

      • Anabelle Z. Llamoso says:

        Would you please guide me – I have a Citizen Super Crystal Date 33 Automatic with 3 stars. Has date. The back says Star S.S. Parawater AUD52803-Y GN Automatic on special marking. There are several numbers which I am not sure how to read. Do you think you can give me some background on this watch.
        Appreciate your reply. Thank you

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Anabelle, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 You have a very nice watch, not often seen, especially outside of Japan. Citizen made ‘super’ versions of some of their watches, for example the Super Deluxe and the Super Jet. The super models have higher jewelling and were subject to higher standards of adjustment before they left the factory. Super movements often had nicely finished movements – do you know if yours has? They were, of course, more expensive than the standard versions, almost twice as expensive for the Super Crystal Date in fact. You have the super version of the Crystal Date. The standard model was made with either 17 or 21 jewels versions of the 5410/5411 movement, which runs at 18,000 beats per hour. The super uses the same movement with 33 jewels:

          These were first produced in 1966, and were only produced for a few years. The movement is part of the 52 Family which also powered the Crystal Seven line – the Crystal Date is the date only version of that range, and has a hard mineral glass which gives it the ‘crystal’ name. The super version usually (but not always) has the special case back:

          52803 is the model / case number, GN is the case type (screw on, waterproof – i.e ‘parawater’) and AUD is the code for this range of automatics with date. The other number is the serial number, and the first three digits will give you the production date. So the one in the above image was made in December 1966 (61201665).

          Hope this helps – please ask if you have any other queries.

          Stephen

    • Vicente Sanz says:

      Hey Stephen, I have a question for you. I have a Citizen 8200 Diver. I am trying to see what year is it, and what do you know about it. 31 Jewels and me, we are trying to find as much as we can about these divers.
      My case # 4-824199y and serial # is 810495.
      thanks

      • sweephand says:

        Hi Vicente – the 8200 movement has been used since around 1975 so dating them can be more difficult. Yours has a six digit serial number so it’s likely to be from after 1980 or so I think. Without seeing it, do you think that 1988 sounds right?

        Stephen

    • spanish says:

      Hi I have this 4-180551TA 63-1230 21 jeweels parawater what is oyur year..? thanks

      • sweephand says:

        Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. From the information you give I think your watch is from the late 1960s or very early 1970s. ‘Parawater’ was changed to ‘water resistant’ from about 1970 so the latest it can be is around 1973. The case number (4-180551) and the model number (63-1230) indicate your watch uses the ‘Homer’ 1800 movement, with date window. Is there a a serial number on the case back? This would help give the exact year of production.

        All the best,
        Stephen

      • spanish says:

        Hi…yes japan 6- 187838-y is this? another thanks

        • sweephand says:

          Hi, ‘6-187838-y’ looks like a dial code – is that printed at the bottom of the dial? It may be that your watch does not have a serial number. Some of these models did not have a serial number so we can only estimate the date of production, which is around 1970.

          Stephen

      • spanish says:

        yes is that printed at the bottom of the dial? getting behind 20300115 congratulacions by your page ,my english is basic sorry and thanks

        • sweephand says:

          Hi, no need to apologise about your English, it’s very much better than my Spanish! Thanks for giving the serial number from the back, that is what we need 🙂 This gives a production date of March, 1972 (from the fist three parts of the number (203). It can’t be 1962 since Citizen didn’t use this kind of model number then (63-1230)and it can’t be 1982 since they didn’t use ‘parawater’ by that time.

          Stephen

          • Kari Sivonen says:

            Hi Stephen, lookslike you know much about Citizen clocks 🙂 So, I got the watch from Dad years ago and it has lied in box a while. It is similar than Joses watch but I have s/n 10900814. Could you tell me about it, please.

            Thanks in advance!

            Kari,
            Finland

            • sweephand says:

              Hi Kari – thanks for visiting my blog. I’m sorry but I’m not sure which is Jose’s watch. Can you please give more info about your watch, thanks

              Stephen

              • Kari Sivonen says:

                Hi Stephen,

                I ment his comment I replied. But here comes info of my clock:
                4-180551TA
                63-1230
                10900814
                “Parawater”

                BR, Kari

                • sweephand says:

                  Hi Kari – thanks for the additional information. What you have is a hand winding watch from September 1971, using the 1800 ‘Homer’ movement – this is the version with a date window. This movement was introduced in 1962 and was in production right through to around 1975, reflecting its quality and reputation for reliability and decent accuracy. The style of the case number (4-180551) and model number (63-1230) are typical of the later models from the end of the 1960s / early 1970s. I don’t think these were made as late as 1981, but if they were it would not be marked ‘parawater’ since ‘water resistant’ was then in use. The Homer models (some were called this on the dial, others had different model names, whist some simply have ‘Citizen’ on the dials) usually came with 17 or 21 jewels, and run at the 18,000 beats per hour. This standard speed means they only need occasional servicing and often run well for many years without any attention at all. I think your model will be 21 jewels – is that correct?

                  Hope this helps, Stephen

      • spanish says:

        ok, hahahaha the spanish is very easy…hahaha if you go to spain .you have here my home…..thanks for all…….good page ; ) and oyur help very good……
        All the best
        jose.

  2. Kahuna74 says:

    Some great pic’s and a lot of good information here, thank you.

  3. jeje3325 says:

    Great review mate, I love your pics and Its a great addition for the future

    Thank you for sharing,

  4. JAY48 says:

    Excellent as always! My favourite has to be 51-2273 as the case has a ‘sub’ feel to it.
    Regards,
    Jay.

  5. FOUCAULT says:

    Où réparer et trouver une couronne vissée pour citizen 8210 modèle 52-0110 de 1977

    • sweephand says:

      Salut Eric,
      J’ai peur des pièces de rechange sont difficiles à trouver, voire impossible, à moins que vous pouvez trouver une montre de donateurs. J’ai contacté quelqu’un que je connais a travaillé sur les plongeurs Citizen vintage donc vous permettra de savoir ce qu’il m’a dit

      Cordialement,
      Stephen

      (Hi Eric,
      I’m afraid replacement parts are hard to find, if not impossible unless you can find a donor watch. I’ve contacted someone who I know has worked on vintage Citizen divers so will let you know what he tells me,

      Regards,
      Stephen)

  6. RossR says:

    Great article. Those divers with the jet movement are so rare. I have not ever seen one for sale – except perhaps for the 39j superjet 150m – which quite rightly isn’t shown here as it does not have a rotating bezel.

  7. Kelvin says:

    Great to find your reviews.
    I have a ‘near new’ B52806 model.
    I bought it new in 1968, and hardly wore it (I considered it too good to wear). They really are a lovely, solid watch.
    Now, at 65+ I doubt I will wear it! Poor thing has been in a drawer all these years.
    So, I need advice please.
    I want to sell it, but probably limited sales here in New Zealand.
    Where do I sell it? Anywhere (world wide) that can be trusted if I send the watch to them?
    What value would the watch have?
    Maybe a reader of your review may want it?
    It really is still fully original, only some very faint marks from when I did wear it.
    Advice greatly appreciated.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Kelvin, great to hear from someone who has had his vintage Citizen from new in 1968 🙂 I’ll send you an e-mail to respond to your questions,

      Stephen

      • MAX says:

        I have a 1968/9 purchased OR-O Diver B52806 which my father bought for me for £32 in the UK. I wore it for years then had other watches but am now back into it. The bezel is missing. Any clue where I might obtain one? I love the watch and it’s not bad without the bezel. Think I scratched it badly in Belgium rock climbing so decided to ditch it!
        I dived in the watch in Scotland. Citizen refuse to service the watch due to the automatic movement. Any ideas on servicing also? Seems to run OK and is accurate to about 2 seconds a day. MAX

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Max, thanks for visiting my blog. Good to hear that you still have an original B52806 🙂 What a shame about the bezel – is it the whole bezel or just the insert? Finding the whole bezel will be very very difficult I’m afraid. I can recommend the ‘Watch Bloke’ (Duncan) for service in the UK. See the blogroll links on the right of the home page.
          Stephen

        • ray says:

          hi, can you please contact me if you have this model:B52806.

    • VIndiz says:

      If the watch has not been sold yet, then contact me because i am interested in it.

    • ray says:

      hi, do you still have the citizen model:B52806?

  8. Eduardo says:

    Hi Sweephand:

    I have one 8210.- Display is a little different from your photos.- My one have’s “Water resistant” and behind 150 M.- Back case numbers are:
    4-820789 Y
    80400276
    GR -4-5
    52-0110
    Date number is in red.- Hand and marker brights as the first day.- It was not exposed to direct sun to much, i suppose that’s the rease why it shines till today.-
    I’ve bought it on 1978, and still works fine, it’s a really good watch.- I’ll try to take some photos to send you soon.-
    This one and my Ploprof are the best watches i have.-
    Very good blog.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Eduardo, thanks for your comments 🙂

      It would be very helpful to see some photos of your watch if it is a bit different form the ones I have posted. Since you bought it new in 1978 we know it will be an original example.

      Stephen

  9. Adam says:

    Dear Sweephand,
    congratulations to your great site that shows real enthusiasm to these great watches!
    I own the diver 63-5370 No.9090253 pictured above, sadly it came with a new aftermarket bezel inlay and not with the nicely worn original.
    I am no friend of “as new” condition and like antique things wearing their signs of use proudly.
    Therefore allow me to ask, if you still have the used hands of your 69 Seven Star Diver? They would harmonise perfectly to my 69 Diver(my minute hand looks like redone).
    When I got the watch it looses about 80 seconds/day and the previous owner told me these movements (think I have the 5410) are not famous for their accuracy. I got it to my watchmaker who explained me that this is only a simple Japanese movement and not to compare with swiss movements of that time.
    I told him this is my absolutly favourite watch and he should make it faster, if possible. 5 minutes later I got it back and until now it ran nearly chronometer like with only minus 5 seconds/day.
    The running time without wear is about 46 hours.
    In your opinion, how often should these watches be serviced by nearly daily wear?
    Thanks a lot and Best Regards from Germany
    Adam

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Adam,
      thank you for your comments, much appreciated 🙂

      I’m afraid I don’t have the old hands from the Seven Star diver – they went to New Zealand where someone was restoring a diver similar to yours.

      As to the comments about the movements not being famous for their accuracy, in my opinion they are actually very good, assuming they are in good condition of course. They may not be ‘famous’ for accuracy – probably because vintage Citizens are not that well known at all in fact! – but I have found the 5xxx and 7xxx series movements, and others too for that matter, can be very accurate indeed. I’ve been wearing a Crystal Date, with the 5401 movement for the last few days and it’s keeping very accurate time.

      Your watch running at -5 seconds per day is superb, but not surprising to me 🙂 And a power reserve of 46 hours is very impressive for a watch that is 40+ years old.

      I’m not a watch mechanic, so I’m not sure about how often a watch should be serviced. I’ve seen some say that you only need to service it if it starts to misbehave, e.g. lose or gain too much time per day, or loses a lot of power reserve. It’s an interesting question though, so I will make some enquiries…

      I’m going to send you an e-mail about something else….

  10. arthur says:

    your collection is amazing, i’m jealous, apparament tu parle français 🙂

    est ce que tu compte vendre une partie de ta collection ou tout garder pour toi? 😀

    • sweephand says:

      thanks for your comment – but I’m afraid I don’t speak French, I have to use an on-line translator!

      I’m using my own collection in the ‘Featured Watches’ series and I use my examples on the special pages, but I also use images from fellow collectors and the internet to give complete information.

      Merci pour votre commentaire – mais je crains que je ne parle pas français, je dois utiliser un traducteur en ligne !

      J’utilise ma propre collection de la série « Featured montres » et j’utilise mes exemples sur les pages spéciales, mais j’utilise aussi des images d’autres collectionneurs et internet pour donner des informations complètes.

      Stephen

  11. Kelvin says:

    Thanks to those who contacted me about my watch ( model B52806).
    My family have now asked me to keep it, so I have accepted their request.
    If this should change, I have promised first option to a fellow forum member.
    Thanks for your interest, I had no idea that the old Divers would be so popular.
    Regards to all.

  12. David Stewart says:

    Hi , thanks for such an interesting site. Against your Model 8200 with the Spade Hands, you have “note incorrect second hand ” The second hand shown is identical to the one on my watch, which is totally original. I purchased it new in 1993 in Borneo ,when I started diving , so I guess it was old stock then!!
    I still use it for diving !,and it has always been very accurate ( within a minute per week )despite spending months unused in the bottomof my dive bag. If you forward your e mail details, I will send you photos of it, c/w its original rubber strap.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi David, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your comments. And thanks as well for pointing out that I had left that comment on the page when in fact the image I’d got (replacing my original one) was of a correct example. Now amended and updated 🙂

      Email sent,

      Stephen

  13. Jim Sanders says:

    Great information here! Thank you.

    I have a Citizen diver that I purchased new in 1978 in Yokosuka, Japan. It keeps excellent time, and the only thing I have changed over the years is the band. i have no idea what it is worth. It would be nice to know, but I’ll never part with it.

    I just took some pics of it and I would love to send them to you. One from the front and one from the back. I didn’t open the case. How would I go about getting pics to you?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jim – great to hear you still have your vintage Citizen 🙂 I’m about to dash out so will reply again, probably tomorrow. In the meantime let me know whether it’s ok for me to e-mail you – that way you can send the pics to me and I can upload them here,

      Stephen

  14. Jim Sanders says:

    You absolutely email me! Thanks for the quick response. Look forward to hearing from you.

  15. Hannu says:

    Hi,

    You have very nice and informative blog! Thanks!

    I got last week a Citizen Parawater 150m (68-5372). Serial number is 21110624, I understood that this means that watch is from 1972.

    Watch has been unused at least 20 years but it is in a quite bad shape. Dial is good but crystal and bezel is covered with scratches and a whole bezel is very loose. There are also some difficulties to set the date. I have quickly tested that watch runs but I don’t know how it keeps time. Now I am thinking to service or repair the watch. I understood from your blog that it is very hard to find replacement parts (crystal, bezel…) but I want to try my luck and ask if you have any ideas where I could get good replacement parts.

    Any details would be greatly appreciated. I can send pictures if it helps.

    Sorry for my bad writing 🙂

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Hannu, thanks for your kind comments 🙂 And sorry for slow reply, I’ve has a busy week with little time on the pc! I agree that your diver is from November 1972, and is one of the rarer of the 150m models, so congratulations on your purchase. There have been some replacement crystals and bezel inserts from a particular seller on eBay, which I think would fit your model, but he has none for sale at the moment. I don’t know whether there will be more, but I will contact him and let you know.

      I would think a good watch maker could service your watch, but if parts are needed then they are likely to be very hard to find. I usually advise that a donor watch / movement is the likeliest source. If you know a good watch guy maybe he could take a look and advise whether or not parts are needed. If so I can try a contact or two to see if there is anything available.

      Your English is fine by the way 🙂

      Stephen

      • Hannu says:

        Thank you!

        I try to send next week my watch to one watch maker. I let you know what he says.

        • sweephand says:

          It looks like crystals may become available again in about 6 weeks or so. I’m still checking on the bezel insert, so will let you know.

          Stephen

  16. panpap says:

    It’s a great article. Thank you very much for the valuable information that I got form it.
    I have a CITIZEN 7 STAR DELUXE PARAWATER 100m. It looks like the one which is shown on the 2 pictures above, under the title “5270 (21 jewels): Compressor – Case Number: 4-520017 Y, Marked ‘Deluxe’ with separate date and day windows, Crowns at 2 and 4 o’clock”
    On its case back, among other engravings, it has this : GN-3-S
    Is this watch a “true diver”? I mean can I swim and having it on my wrist?
    It doesn’t look to me, as its crowns don’t screw down.
    I also want to ask you whether it’s possible to find a replacement innner bezel and the crown that rotates the bezel.
    Thank you very much again
    Panpap

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Panpap, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments 🙂 As far as I know a watch rated to 100m is ok for swimming, but I would not advise trying it with a vintage watch unless it has been very properly serviced with new gaskets and pressure tested. Even then I would not dare to try it! The ‘compressor’ style divers don’t use screw down crowns, but they are just as effective since water pressure makes the seal even more effective. The important thing about crowns on divers is that they have an effective sealing / gasket design – for example the first Seiko diver (the ’62MAS’), rated to 150m didn’t have a screw down crown.

      I think the only way to find a replacement inner bezel and crown / gear is to find a donor watch. Parts for these aren’t available these days.

      Hope this helps,
      Stephen

  17. Pratik says:

    Hi Stephen,
    I came acroos an interesting looking Parawater with a crown shaped logo with a 7 in it.Was this ever a citizen logo used on the parawater models?The case back says Parawater, but at the 9 o’ clock position on the dial, there’s an other number, “111”. What does this signify?

    Also do you think the cursive font on a parawater is normal?

    Please view the link attached for your reference.

    Regards,
    Pratik

    http://www.ebay.in/itm/VINTAGE-RARE-CITIZEN-7-AUTOMATIC-MEN-STEEL-CALIBER-8200-JAPAN-RARE-WATCH-RUNNING-/251329125930?pt=IN_Watches&hash=item3a84621e2a&_uhb=1#ht_1230wt_1186

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Pratik, the watch in the link looks like a cobbled together ‘franken’ to me I’m afraid. The seller says it’s an 8200 movement, yet the back is from a 72xx series. No 8200 will be legitimately found in a ‘parawater’ watch either – the 8200 was first produced in 1975 so ‘water resistant’ was in use by then. The hand set looks to be after market (or from a later 8200 model maybe). The dial may be from a ‘Superking’ (the cursive font for that seems ok from what I can see) but I’ve never seen ‘111’ before, nor the 7 logo at 12 o’clock, so those features could be from a re-diallers imagination!

      ‘Parawater’ and the 7 logo appeared on some of the second generation Jet rotor models:

      and the Seven, a hand winding version of those automatics:

      Stephen

  18. Lynn D Rudd says:

    I have an old Citizen watch that may have belonged to my grandfather. The model (I’m told by Citizen) is AC6102-52A with the following stamped on the back:6031-S07734 SMW . 8082469 GN-4-S→5 Help! Lynn

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Lynn, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂

      The watch you have is a quartz model, so it’s not one I’m familiar with I’m afraid. I’ve had a quick look around and I found an example on eBay – it has a very ‘retro’ style, taking its look from much older watches. The information from the case back tells us that it uses a 6031 quartz movement – this technical document I found says that the 6031 movement was in fact used in ladies’ watches: http://www.awci.com/wp-content/uploads/watch-tech-guides/CITIZEN-TECH-GUIDES/6031-Technical-Information.pdf

      Unfortunately the technical guide isn’t dated, but from the style and use of quartz, I would guess that yours is most likely from August 1988 (from the first 3 digits in the serial number (strong>8082469). It is possible that it’s from 1998, so I can’t be sure since I don’t have any reference material for the very many quartz models Citizen has made over the years.

      Hope this helps a bit!
      Stephen

      • pudman2 says:

        Here’s a pic if it’ll help. Looks a little big for a lady but it could have been Mom’s

        Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Lynn – I’m afraid you aren’t able to post photos directly. But I did have a look at an example of the model. The reference to the 6031 movement being in ladies’ watches was in the technical guide so I presume that is correct.

          Stephen

  19. Alan Ren says:

    Hi

    I just bought a Citizen New Master 33 Parawater.

    Can you please help me to date it and perhaps tell if of its rarity. It is also slow 5 mins every hours (any way to rectify this?)

    I cannot post photos here but you can see my watch at: http://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/citizen-newmaster-parawater-21-jewels-63-1396-please-help-date-watch-917335.html#post6785341

    Thanks for your help.

    Alan

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan, thanks for visiting my blog. You’ll probably kick yourself when I tell you the production date of your watch 🙂 What you might think is a serial number on the back – 197104 – is actually the date it was made: April 1971. There are a few models where Citizen used this system, so you can find examples with the same number on because they were made in the same month and year.

      Generally speaking the later Newmaster models from around the early 1970s are fairly common, but yours is more unusual since it has a date window. So yours has the ‘Homer’ 18xx movement in it – typically this age of Newmaster would have the 02xx movement with a plain dial.

      Since it’s running very slow it sounds to me like it needs a strip down, clean and service, but bear in mind that spares would only be available from a donor watch. You could ask a watch repairer to try de-magnetizing it, that could be the problem, or to see if its hairspring is caught up. They could resolve the running issue without the expense of a service.

      Stephen

      • Alan Ren says:

        Thanks Stephen. I have only started to collect watches. I am glad I found your blog. It is indeed useful. I will be very grateful if you can also comment on another watch which I bought a little earlier ( a week ago). I have posted the photos here http://forums.watchuseek.com/f11/citizen-newmaster-please-help-age-watch-915228.html#post6767201 Can you tell me when this was made and if it is a rare watch. This one is very precise (perfect time always). Thank you for your time.

        • sweephand says:

          You’re welcome 🙂 You have a variant of the one you asked about before, using the same movement. However this one is an export version, i.e. made for the western market. This is indicated by the use of ‘waterproof’ rather than ‘parawater’, as well as ‘shockproof’ and ‘anti-magnetic’ which are not found on models for the Japanese domestic market. The use of ‘waterproof’ (and ‘parawater’) was phased out in the early 1970s, when manufacturers had to use ‘water resistant’ instead. The latest date I’ve seen on a ‘parawater/waterproof’ model is 1973. Your watch doesn’t seem to have a serial number – can you make out the full number on the back? It looks like it may be a model number to me. It’s possible that there is a serial number on the inside of the case back, but I think it’s unlikely. A few of the basic models from the early 1970s do not have serial numbers unfortunately which would allow us to pin the production date down.

          Good to hear the watch is running well and accurately – the Homer movement is a very sound and reliable one and was used by Citizen for around 15 years. And the HMT company in India still uses the same design in their watches!

          Stephen

  20. Alan Ren says:

    Many thanks again Stephen. The seller at the flea market told me that all these watches came from an old shop which closed down some twenty years ago. He still does have some more Citizens apart from others but they are no longer in working condition. Do you think if it is worth it is worth buying them if he wants GBP 5 each? I have seen a few Citizen automatics (square shape and a round one too) but sadly none are working and I dare not take the risk.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan – I think it depends what the models are. If they were interesting / rarer models they could be useful for parts. If they are the later 8200 models then I would think not since working examples of them can easily be found.

      Stephen

  21. Alan Ren says:

    Dear Stephen

    Many thanks again. I think I better go to his house later today and get photos to show you. Have a great evening.

  22. Alan Ren says:

    Hi Stephen

    Can you please have a look at this one and let me know if it is rare and worth keeping even for parts? Thanks

    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/citizen-automatic-waterproof-21-jewels-please-help-date-watch-917875.html#post6789687

  23. Alan Ren says:

    Hi Stephen

    Can you please have a look at this second citizen watch and let me know if it is rare and worth keeping even for parts? Thanks

    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/citizen-automatic-water-resistant-please-help-me-date-watch-917877.html#post6789692

  24. Alan Ren says:

    Hi Stephen

    Can you please have a look at this third citizen watch and let me know if it is rare and worth keeping even for parts? Thanks for your time. I really appreciate it. Alan

    http://forums.watchuseek.com/f21/citizen-automatic-waterproof-21-jewels-please-help-tell-me-more-about-watch-917879.html#post6789696

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alan – I’ve had a look at the three watches. My observations are:
      #1: From June 1970, this is an export model (marked waterproof / no model name). If the bracelet is complete and signed ‘Citizen’ then it may be worth having, just for the bracelet
      #2: 6501 automatic from August 1974 – missing hour markers on the dial etc, I would suggest not worth getting
      #3: Custom V2 from October 1972 – might be worth getting if the band is complete and in good condition, if signed Citizen it may be original.
      I’d try and get them for less than £5 each though – maybe £5 for the two, since you don’t know whether or not the movements have salvageable parts. To me the bracelets are the most interesting bits. The movements in these are not rare so if you ever needed parts in the future they should be relatively easy to find via a donor watch at the time.

      Stephen

  25. sharron says:

    Hi Stephen
    I have an old Citizen watch in new condition and I like to know more about please.

    Thanks
    Sharron

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Sharron, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 You have a very nice watch – it’s in super condition, and great to have the Citizen tag with it. Although this kind of colourful dial and the faceted crystal, very evocative of the 1970s, are not to everyone’s taste, it is a very nice example. The movement in yours is the 6000 (as stamped on the back) – the movement number will be stamped on the movement near the balance wheel and will be 6000 or 6001. This is the date only version of the 65 movement family. The day and date movements are numbered 6500 and 6501. It’s unusual to see a date only version in this style of dress watch in my experience – the same 6000 is used in the sought after 150m diver. The 6000/1 came with either 17 or 21 jewels and runs at 21,600 beats per hour.

      The other information on the case back is as follows:
      4-600975 – is the case number
      62-6775 – is the model number
      40902028 – is the serial number, from which we can date the watch. The 6500 & 6000 movements were first made in 1971 and had a fairly short production run as Citizen developed quartz technology and vastly reduced their range of mechanical watches. So yours was made in September 1974 (40902028).

      Stephen

  26. ebay4israel says:

    Thank you for your help 🙂

  27. marc says:

    hello excuse my English, I’m using a translator,
    I have a watch of my grandfather. I could give information about the watch. is CITIZEN wáter resist. base metal top. stainless steel back.
    4-211898 Y
    44-9326
    gn-7w-s
    japan
    gp

    THANK YOU VERY MUCH

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Marc – thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 I don’t know that model I’m afraid. Could you please tell me a bit more about it, especially what is printed on the dial?

      Stephen

  28. RBK says:

    Dear Sweephand,

    My father has a Citizen 6000 series.
    The 600851 model.
    However the condition of the watch isn’t very good.
    For example the bezel is missing.
    Is it hard to find parts for this watch?
    I will try to upload some pictures.

    Kind regards,
    RBK

    • sweephand says:

      Hi RBK, thanks for visiting my blog 🙂

      I’m afraid you can’t post pictures directly – if you can upload them to somewhere like Photobucket you can post a link. Or I can email you and you can send them to me to post. Let me know if you want me to do that.

      Parts are very hard to source, usually finding a ‘donor’ watch is the way to obtain them. Your father’s watch should be a 150m diver if the back is marked 4-600851 – that’s the case number in fact, and 62-6198 is the model number. Is that correct? And is the whole bezel missing or the insert? It will certainly be hard to find the whole bezel, but there have been some inserts and crystals available recently – new, but made to the original specs. There may be more of them at some point.

      Stephen

      • RBK says:

        Dear Stephen,

        You can send me an email, then I will send you the pictures of the watch back.
        The watch is indeed a 150m diver. The numbers are also correct.

        I found this link of yours: https://sweep-hand.org/2012/09/20/before-after-bezel-insert-change/ with which I believe is the same watch (but then with bezel).

        One more thing; the glass of the watch isn’t original I believe.
        But perhaps with the pictures it will become more clear.

        Kind regards,
        RBK

  29. alain rivera says:

    Hi Stephen,
    I have a Citizen 8946-087879 Y
    8021599. GN-4-S.
    Could you be so kind to tell me what year it was made and any info about it?

    Thanks a lot.
    Alain

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alain, your model is a quartz Promaster Wingman I believe. These are not within my collecting parameters, but after a bit of research I understand the 8946 movement was first produced in the 1980s. The 8943 was the first version, and that was launched in November 1981 in a model known as the Digiana Jet Boy! The first two digits of the serial number on yours – 8021599 – indicate that yours was made in February 1988.

      I’ve uploaded a technical manual for your movement, access it here: http://homepage.ntlworld.com/stephen.netherwood/2693_Citizen%208940%20etc.pdf – please feel free to download it if you wish since I might need to delete it later if I need the space!

      Stephen

  30. Alain Rivera says:

    Thanks a lot Stephen, Your comment and info has been very instructive for me. Thanks for your time and support!

    Just another question, I am thinking very seriusly to buy a new Citizen Watch, Can you advise me what will be a good choice for quality-price?

    Thanks again.

    Best regards,

    Alain.

    • sweephand says:

      You’re welcome Alain 🙂 I’m afraid I don’t know the new models, but I would think that an eco-drive model in what ever is your price range would be a very good choice. I use the cheapest model when I’m working outside, when I don’t want to put a vintage model at risk, and it’s just fine.

      Stephen

  31. Jajo says:

    Hi Stephen,
    first of all: THANKS for your GREAT website!
    For years, this has been both, a great inspiration and helpful/educative resource for me!
    I do collect CTZ, too (not at your scale & expertise though, not by far ;-)). Although I own many windup CTZ’s, my main focus is the battery driven ones. Like of course the Cosmotrons – but also the later early quartz watches (both analog and digital). As long as it is prior to 1980 (with exeption of some few and destinct later models which I find interesting, like i.e. the Voice Recorder).
    You may already guess where this is heading…: CTZ Crystron models.
    The CTZ expert you are, you will obviously be familiar with these – and must have deliberately decided to not expand into that field of quartz watches yourself (or at least: not yet?). Which is fine and I’m not going to try to talk you into Crystrons ;-).
    However, since your great sum-up of vintage CTZ divers covers “1962-1980”, you might want to at least mention that there also was the first CTZ QUARTZ divers available in that time-range. In fact, I think that one of the Crystron divers models, though probably “not within your collecting parameters” would actually deserve more than a mention. Since in the 1970s, it was one of the most expensive CTZ watches – and from looking at your extensive list of CTZ divers, it was also the one with the highest depth-rating back then: 600M!

    This would of course be the CTZ “Crystron 600M” model 60-0997 (4-860756 Y, GN-3) of 1977. Movement is Quartz 8620. The watch is a true divers: screwdown crown, uni-directional bezel/divers ring with 60 clicks. All steel mono-case – with an almost 4mm thick mineral crystal.
    As far as I know, this watch was only produced 1977 and in rather small numbers (serialnumbers are 7-digit only). The very same case was used 1978 again, with the later 7100/7300 quartz movement (4-730674 Y / 44-0035).

    If you want pictures let me know and I will take some.
    There also was a handful other “Crystron” divers rated 100M and 150M (ranging 1978-1981 from my database), but these are probably less of a milestone as the 600M is.
    BTW: I guess from a “practical” point of view, the quartz divers must have been a bit of a failure… The battery only lasts about a year – and in order to replace it, you need to take apart most of the watch to access it. The need to replace the cell every year AND making sure it will still withstand 600M afterwards is a hassle you don’t have with any automatic divers… 😉
    The 100M and 150M models feature standard screwdown backs and the cells lasts a bit longer on the 7100/7300 quartz movements, so it is a bit easier on them.

    Well, though “Crystrons” seem not to be within your own collecting pattern, I thought you might still find this interesting.

    Thanks again for all your educative work and enlightenments!

    Best regards and greetings from Germany,
    Jajo

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jajo, thanks for visiting my blog and I’m very pleased to hear that you have found it useful 🙂 Thanks also for a very interesting comment about Citizen’s early quartz watches, and particularly the Crystron 600m diver. You’re right that I have limited my collection to mechanical, electro-mechanical and tuning fork watches prior to 1980 but of course the quartz models reached the market within that time frame. I’ve not researched those models though so I don’t much reference material to work from. For the diver page to be complete I should include any models that were produced before 1980 especially given the specifications of the 600m Crystron. Would you be happy to share the info on your database, and photos too, so that I can add the relevant quartz models? That would be very helpful indeed, and of course I’d give you full credit. Thanks again for taking time to comment – please let me know if you’d like me to email you direct, which would be easier for exchanging info / photos,

      Stephen

  32. Steve Oliverio says:

    Hello,

    Fantastic and informative site. The images (#22 and 23) of the orange dial 100m Parawater were taken by me when I owned the watch. Please feel free to continue to use them.

    Best,

    Steve Oliverio

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Steve, first of all, thanks for visiting my blog and your kind comments 🙂 And thank you as well for giving permission for the continued use of your photos. At the time of writing I wasn’t aware who had done them. I have now added a note to credit them to you.

      Stephen

  33. Sean says:

    Hi Sweephand,

    I like the blog. I’m not a collector but I have an automatic citizen that belonged to my grandfather that I’d like to keep running, if feasible. I’m assuming from information above that it was made in Jan 1972 with its serial no. of 20100524. The other information is 4-740025 Y and 68-5194. It had been running erratically (losing 5 mins a day) up until relatively recently but now stops for quite a while.

    Can you advise me how to proceed and the approximate costs involved, obviously it is more sentimental value than monetary value. How can I tell which watches it shares a movement with?

    Thanks very much,

    Sean

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Sean, thanks for visiting my blog – you’re right that your watch was made in 1972; the case number (4-740025) tells us that it has a 74xx movement in it, which was made with a number of different jewel counts from 21 to 31. Most of these were ‘high-beat’ running at 28,800 or 36,000 beats per hour. From the model number (68-5194) we see that yours is the 21 jewel version which runs at 21,600 beats per hour. The 74xx is the date only version of the 77 movement family, whilst 72xx models, which are much more often seen, were date and day versions. The 21 jewel movement number is 7470, which should be stamped on the movement close to the balance wheel if you were to remove the case back. The 72 versions with 21 jewels (7270) will share movement parts if they are needed – the models to search for with that movement are from the ‘Seven Star V2’ range. However, providing the functions in yours (e.g. date change, hand and auto-winding) are working correctly, it may be that it just needs a thorough clean and service, especially if it has not been serviced for a long time. Old oil can gum it up and stop it running properly.

      Although these are relatively straightforward automatic watches that a good watch maker should be able to service, you would want someone who is used to working on good quality mechanical pieces to do the work. Where are you located?

      Finally here’s a pic of ‘your’ watch (I have seen a white or silver dialled one too), from a 1974 German catalog (pic by ‘Axel66’ on the SCWF):

      Stephen

  34. Sean says:

    Hi Stephen,

    thank you very much for going above and beyond with your reply. I’m located in Dublin. I had tried to drop it into an old watchmaker whom seemed to be the sort to be able to fix it (rather than the sort who are only able to change batteries or return to the manufacturers) but it is difficult to know how competent someone else is when you are not an expert yourself. I know there is an official citizen service centre in Shannon, Co. Clare so I might ring them during next week but I assume they will be more comfortable with more recent models.

    I hope the watch only does need a service- the face certainly needs to be cleaned up. I checked the watch over the weekend against a compass and it seems very magnetic which could have (unintentional pun) some bearing on the matter.

    My watch is the silver face model similar to this (http://uhrforum.de/citizen-automatik-1974-68-5194-a-t54223) model but without the red second hand and on a metal bracelet.

    Thank you kindly for your reply, I actually think unlike some watches of the era its design stands up very well today and I really like the sweep of the second hand (although I really like the look of that rally style strap).

    Take care,

    Sean

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Sean, you’re welcome 🙂 It’s certainly worth running the watch through a de-magnetiser (your local guy should be able to do that) to see if it makes a difference. I doubt Citizen will be able to help, they won’t have parts and probably don’t work on older models. I’ve had someone recommended to me who is in the UK if you are happy to mail the watch, but it’s worth checking whether it’s magnetised first,

      Stephen

  35. Sean says:

    Thanks Stephen,

    it is definitely magnetised but I think the watch may have been over wound by hand so I might contact the person you recommend for a quote. The face could use a clean in any case and I’d rather someone competent did it. Good news on the parts front though.

    Sean

  36. Tony.Lo says:

    hi stephen,
    can you help to identify this watch ,this is my grandfather 21JEWELS,information back as below,
    4-062981SMT
    90696079
    71-1845
    JAPAN
    G.P.
    BASE METAL TOP
    thanks
    Tony 2014-02-20

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Tony, thank you for visiting my blog. Although I haven’t got a reference to the model you have (71-1845) or case number (4-062981) I believe it is an automatic with the 8200 movement inside. Other model numbers that start with ’71’ use this movement, and some are listed in the 1977 case parts guide. It’s possibly from June 1979 (from first three digits of the serial number 90696079). Does this production date fit with when your grandfather acquired it? Does the watch have an eagle logo on the dial? If it does it would be later than that, maybe 1989 – the 8200 movement has been used in many models for over 30 years so it can be difficult to pin a production date down. GP is for gold plated of course over a ‘base metal’ case, probably a nickel alloy I think.

      The 8200 is a sound and reliable movement, used for many years by Citizen – how is yours running? Here’s some more info:
      Stephen

      • Tony.Lo says:

        hi Stephen,
        thanks for you so detail respond ,this watch still running smooth and on time, if you interest i can send photo to your email, pls give me your information
        nice to talk with you
        thanks
        Tony

  37. Alex Robertson says:

    Stephen I have a few more of the 150M nos mineral crystal, some of your bloggers may have interest. Ebay ID seikomania

  38. Mikko Kiljunen says:

    Hi Stephen. First of all I have to thank you for very informative webpages. They have been very helpful! I have nice Citizen diver model 67-5776 which is not running at the moment. Presently, the watch is in my watch maker and we don’t know what parts we need yet. However, if new parts are needed I have been looking for spares or donor piece to make it running again. Based on you review this model should have 7470 movement (“7470 (21 jewels): Model Number: 67-5776 / Case Number: 4-720521 4-721641 Y & Y”). However, according the case number (4-7220521y) it has 72XX series movement? Case numbers in your example photos also start with 4-72. So, is there error regarding the movement number of this watch in your page? My understanding is that parts between 7270 and 7470 are interchangeable except 7270 has a day disc? Watch has also cracked crystal (I assume its not original) and I have no idea where to find new one. I believe several types of acrylic crystals would fit, but I would like to find as original looking as possible. Any ideas about the shape and style of the original crystal and where to obtain one? High resolution photo of the crystal would be great help.

    I also would like to have your opinion about the reluming of the hands and hour markers. Dial is in great shape and lume is intact, but it has some ageing…especially hands are pretty bad. As a watch collector would recommend reluming or not and how these options would affect on value of the watch? My present plans is to relume only the hands of the watch and leave the dial as it is. I really appreciate your help!

    Cheers,

    -MIKKO-

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mikko, thanks for visiting 🙂 Firstly thanks for pointing out the typo! The movement is of course the 7270 – I’d got that right in the text but not in the sub-heading so I’ve now corrected it. As you say, 7470 would have denoted a date only model. I don’t have one of these so I can’t provide any photos of the crystal I’m afraid. I presume the case of the 7270 versions are the same as the 5270 versions – if so the part number for the plastic crystal is 54-0369, which measures 32.62mm across. I’ve checked Yahoo Japan, where original crystals can sometimes be found, but there’s nothing listed at the moment. I can only go on what I’ve seen on other examples – Google images seem to show these with a raised crystal, e.g. http://i573.photobucket.com/albums/ss177/WVE_2009/PB078347.jpg

      To re-lume or not is not always agreed – my own view is that if it is in poor condition then it is better to have it re-done. I’d probably leave it if it is not too bad, or just do the hands if they are in worse condition. It has to be done very well though, and by someone who has the right skills – I would think it would add value compared to a watch which looks ‘tatty’ due to the state of the lume. In the end it’s your choice of course, but lume in poor condition is not good to look at! Also I would say that lume can look a lot worse when photographed close-up, so I would judge it from how it looks on the wrist, which is how we look at watches in real life after all 🙂

      Stephen

      • Mikko says:

        Stephen, thanks for your quick response. Crystal part number and dimensions are great help! Hope we can source it from somewhere. Your view about re-luming is pretty in line with mine, so I will re-lume the hands first and see how it looks like. Problem with the dial is the shape of the lume dots. They are square shape and slightly raised with sharp corners. Therefore, re-luming of the dots would be extremely challenging and I assume they would never look the same. Thanks for your help!

        -MIKKO-

        • sweephand says:

          You’re welcome Mikko. Good luck with the re-luming of the hands 🙂 I’ll keep a look out for the crystal, but it could be a looooooong time before one turns up, if at all! I’ve been able to check that the part number for the 72 movement is the same as the 52 one.

          Stephen

  39. Jacobo says:

    Hello, I need help about a vintage Citizen diver 62-6198 ( 4-600851Y) model.
    I’m from Spain, and my english is not good, but I will try that you can understand me.
    I need a crown for this watch. I have two options, search for an original crown (very difficult) or search a similar crown.
    I have 3 questions about it:
    1. Can you sell me the original crown?
    2. Can you tell me the technical specifications of this crown for search one similar?
    3. Can you sell me any similar crown that I will can use in this watch?
    I hope that you can help me, and please, if you can’t do it, answer me anyway or tell me where I can ask.
    Thanks!!!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jacobo – thanks for visiting my blog. I’ve been away from my pc today and it’s late now, so I will get back to you tomorrow with some information. And your English is fine – much better than my Spanish! 🙂

      Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jacobo – the part number for the original crown is 506-5061. If you were to look for a donor watch as a source for the crown, there are several other models that use the same one. These are:
      1. 62-5372
      2. 52-0110
      3. 4-722710 (a very scarce model)
      There are three quartz divers that use this crown too, case numbers are: 4-730453, 4-732308, 4-732316.
      Unfortunately a donor watch for any of these isn’t going to be very easy to find, and the prices of even junk examples are rising.

      I don’t have a spare crown to sell I’m afraid, and I don’t know whether there are other crowns you could use. I’ll see if I can get any more information for you from someone I know who has worked on these divers, and get back to you as son as I can.

      Stephen

  40. Jacobo says:

    Thanks Stephen!!! I have other question, my bezel move free (and in both directions).
    Has the original bezel “clicks”? or is it continuos?
    Is it unidirectional o bidirectional?

    Thanks.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jacobo – the bezel on mine moves smoothly (no clicks) in both directions, like yours. As far as I know that is correct.

      Stephen

      • Jacobo says:

        Hello, Stephen I have found the crown with your help!!! Thank you very much. I want to ask you any thing, have you the number of the all components? (I need buy other thing for the minimum order) bezel,hands, stem… anything to see if the shop has it.

        • Jacobo says:

          gaskets, crystal…

          • sweephand says:

            Hi Jacobo – great to hear you found a crown 🙂 Where did you find it?
            I don’t think the bezel has a part number, it would be referenced as the 4-600851 case. There are new bezel inserts to original spec on eBay, item number: 351072706754

            Here are some part numbers:
            Crystal – 54-50050 (eBay item # for a replacement: 351073908067)
            Stem: 065-1070
            Back gasket: 393-0045
            If the hour and minute hands are the same as the 52-0110 (this would need to be checked) the part number is: A58-65762.

            Stephen

  41. Jacobo says:

    Thanks Stephen!!! But unfortunately in the online shop doesn’t have any of that parts, anyway to complete the minimum order I will buy two crowns.
    The online shop is: https://stsupplyonline.com/catalog/login.php
    I don’t know if they sell the original part or replacement but I don’t find other site to buy it.

    • sweephand says:

      that’s interesting Jacobo – I had seen that supplier before but had not followed it up. The crown on my 62-6198 has lost some of its plating, so when you get the two crowns if you want to sell one to help with the costs, please let me know 🙂

      Stephen

  42. Jacobo says:

    Hello Stephen, Where are you from?
    If you are in EEUU maybe is better that you buy 2 and send me one. The more economic shipping cost to Spain are 17$. I have sended an email to ask for a low price, I think is high for only one or two crowns.
    Tell me that you think about buy you it or otherwise.
    I wait you answer to buy it or wait that you do.

    • sweephand says:

      I’m in the UK Jacobo. I don’t know whether it would be better sending to me or not, I would think it would be the same to anywhere in Europe. What is the price for two crowns?

      Stephen

  43. jhaworthjr says:

    I need help. I have an early Citizen’s OR-O Diver B52806 Watch that runs well but needs servicing and a crown Where can I get my watch repaired? Thanks. jhaworthjr

    • sweephand says:

      Thanks for visiting my blog – where in the world are you from? The biggest issue with vintage Citizens is the lack of spares – if your watch is running ok, it may be that a service is all that is required. Finding a crown is not going to be easy! Is it missing altogether? The original part number for yours is 506-502. The B52806 is rare so a ‘donor’ watch, often the best way of sourcing spare parts, is unlikely to be found. I’ll try and find out whether there is any alternative for the crown.

      Stephen

      • Demimo says:

        Hi Stephen from sweep-hand,

        I do have a 4-730453 model (150 m water resist). Could you help me with stating the value of this particular model? This I would very appreciate as I am struggling to do so myself! Thank you in advance, nice blog you established here.

        • sweephand says:

          Thanks for visiting my blog – from the case number you have a Crystron (quartz) 150m diver from the late 1970s / early 1980s. I avoid trying to give valuations since so many things can affect value. In general terms, if it’s in good / excellent condition then it will be of some interest, so is likely to sell, but it won’t make the same kind of money that a mechanical diver would. I can only suggest searching eBay to get some idea of value.

          Stephen

  44. Chris R says:

    Very informative blog, Stephen. I have owned a Rolex perpetual datejust (circa 1960) and have owned a citizen diver (circa 1987). I am thinking of selling my Rolex and buying a vintage citizen diver, as these are generally more durable and less costly to maintain. I have been looking to buy a Super Jet Diver (circa 1968), but am finding these are rare and rarely come up for sale. I will probably have to expand my search to vintage Citizen divers more generally. I do like the automatic, self-winding feature of these watches. Do you have any advice on what red flags to look for in a vintage citizen diver when buying on ebay? And, before what date are citizen divers considered “vintage”?

    Chris

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Chris, thanks for visiting my blog. Sorry for not replying yet, should be able to do it tomorrow night

      Stephen

    • sweephand says:

      hi Chris, apologies again for the delay in replying – weather here is so good I’ve been outside all the time! You’re right that the Super Jet Diver is a rare bird. I’ve seen a few very good examples for sale on Yahoo Japan, where they fetch high prices. I would certainly recommend Yahoo Japan as the place to look for this model. At the other end of the scale, the 52-0110 model with the 8200 date only movement is the least expensive to buy, and is easier to maintain since ‘donor’ movements are easy to find. Donor movements for the 62-6198 are also reasonably easy to find. Having said that, none of Citizen’s vintage divers, especially in good condition, are particularly easy to find. Cases and case parts are always hard to come by, so an original case and bezel in good condition is essential. Recently there has been a small supply of new bezel inserts and crystals for the 1970s models, made to the original specs.

      As to what’s vintage, my definition is up to and including the 1970s, i.e before the quartz revolution took hold and the watch market changed forever.

      From a collector’s point of view, the older and rarer models are of greater interest, but that brings the problem of lack of spares should parts ever be needed. As to what to look out for on eBay, I think the best examples are likely to be one-off sales from long term owners rather than the regular sellers. If you do see one for sale from a regular seller I would certainly recommend checking out opinions on the seller, for example on the Seiko and Citizen Watch Forum. I hope my page on the divers will help check out any that you see for sale, and by all means come back and ask questions if you want to check it out.

      Stephen

  45. noufal ahamed says:

    Stephen can you please help me out to find what is the model and year of this particular watch which i bought on ebay,since nothing is written i am clueless.


    • sweephand says:

      Hi Noufal, thanks for visiting my blog. I was away from home for a few days so couldn’t reply sooner. Your watch is an ‘Eagle 7’, using Citizen’s 8200 automatic movement. These were introduced in the 1980s, so yours was made in either June 1985 or June 1995. Unfortunately I can’t say which for sure since these were made for quite a long time, but from its condition I would have thought 1985 is likely.

      Stephen

  46. noufal ahamed says:

    thanks Stephen,Help greatly appeciated.

  47. noufal ahamed says:

    @stephen
    almost every watch i saw in this series has either “Automatic” or “21 jewels” written inside the dial area ,My watch has nothing.It makes me doubtful if it is a real one.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Noufal, yes you are right, the dial should be marked ’21 Jewels’ and ‘automatic’. It may be a real one, but I guess the dial has been re-painted. The movement looks correct.

      Stephen

  48. Audun says:

    I have just missed a B52806 on auction in Sweden. I have searched ebay for similar early 150m divers. Do you have any hints on places where I can find a watch as this, or what calibers are most common? I intend to use it, not just collecting. I have seen some with the smaller crown, but not to fond of those.

    Audun, Norway

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Audun, thank you for visiting my blog. Sorry that you missed out on the B53206, they rarely come up. None of the vintage Citizen mechanical divers are common – you are most likely to see the 52-0110 model, which uses the 8200 automatic movement, then it would probably be the 62-6198 with the 6000 movement. A plus point for getting the 52-0110 those is that 8200 parts are available through ‘donor’ watches. Not surprisingly the earlier the diver model, the rarer it is, and some are, as the saying goes, ‘rarer than hen’s teeth’! Other than eBay, the sales forum at SCWF (Seiko and Citizen Watch Forum) might be worth looking at (see the link in my ‘blogroll’ to take a look if you don’t know it already. The other possibility is the Yahoo Japan auctions (no eBay in Japan), but you have to buy through a third party service like ‘Buyee’ or ‘Japamart’, so there are extra costs to factor in. There aren’t very many divers even on Yahoo Japan and good examples command high prices, but it’s certainly worth a look.

      Stephen

  49. Audun says:

    Many thanks! Seems like it is possible to find a 52-0110 on ebay, though I will wait for the right one. Looks like they are quite rare even on SCWF.

  50. Samu says:

    Hey Stephen, when I first time found your fantastic blog my rolex passion turn to citizen maniac and seikos also stepped aside so its your fault my watchfever got worse:) luckily with less money;)
    I have now several divers, 68-xxx, 62-xxxx, 52-xxxx (thanks to you I can now inspect all little diffrencies in dials and whatever there is) and because my modest (little) watchmaker skills Ill manage doing little restoring by myself but…It seems to be always same problem: when Ill buy new watches in sensible condition or donor watches there is always missing mercedes style hands! (Diver style) I mean always, so can you tell me where I can find original hand sets ( one or two) or replacement style, ofcourse worn up vintage is my passion but somtimes you have to give up, 90’s style big flat sword hands are terrific and I hate them, anyway, thank you so much for this lesson in citizen divers and also to all readers, all questions are very important to get usefull knowledge!

  51. Bart says:

    Hi,

    I was wondering if the movement 8210a in the 52-0110 diver could be replaced by a brand new 8200 movement, is it compatible? The size seems the same 25.6mm 5.2mm.

    Kind regards,
    Bart

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Bart, thanks for visiting my blog. Good question! I am not a watchmaker / restorer so I can’t be absolutely certain. The 8200 has been developed over the years, but I guess it remains fundamentally the same. You’d want the 8215 Miyota movement since that is date only. I’ve had a look at an image of a new movement and compared it with my 1970’s one and it looks to be the same design, beyond cosmetic difference to the rotor. See here for info: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk. If you search for ‘Citizen’, then scroll down the page where you can find and compare the 82xx movements. The 8210 was the original used in the 52-0110.

      Stephen

      • Melanie Athena says:

        Hello Stephen,
        I just wrote and tried to post, but it seems it didn’t go through… so if this is a repeat, please excuse. Great job you’ve done here; lots of helpful information, and I’m sure it took a great deal of time compiling it all. Congratulations and many thanks!

        I’m writing about my Ladies Citizen Quartz GN-4-S. I believe it’s never been used; in original (plastic) box, marked Citizen, with plastic C. tag on rope hanging from watch, and paper wrap on the leather band. It has a Cream colored face, lumed hour, minute and second hands, date indicator, gold colored case, tachymeter that goes up to 500. On face: Citizen Quartz, Water Resist, and at bottom edge, MOV’T JAPAN DIAL TAIWAN 6010-50904Z SMS.

        On back of case: Citizen Watch Co, Water Resist, (these two are covered in part by a circular silver sticker that looks like it has a faded hologram of watch hands on it, don’t know if more info is hidden under, didn’t want to remove it), Base Metal YP (yellow plate?),
        6010-S15656 SMG, 00501412 (serial number?), GN-4-S, this followed by a stamped block arrow pointing to a number 5.

        It has a lovely dark brown leather band, which still has the paper/cardboard packaging attached.

        What if anything, can you tell me about this watch? Is it in fact a diver? There’s no meter rating, as far as I can tell, unless it’s under the sticker on the back. Also would you have any idea of it’s value? I’d planned on selling it, but may change my mind and keep it for myself if it’s a good swimming watch.. It’s very delicate design, but very sturdy and functional looking, A gorgeous watch, even for a quartz. 🙂

        Many thanks, I appreciate any help you can give me!

        Al the best, Melanie

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Melanie, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments, they are much appreciated 🙂 Your first try did appear for me to ‘approve’ so I have deleted that one – the blog software requires that all comments have to be approved by me before they appear.

          I have been able to have a look at your watch on the web – it is in very nice condition and it’s good to see the box and tag etc. I am not an expert on quartz models, especially relatively recent ones, so please bear that in mind when reading this reply. Since it has a dial made in Taiwan, I would think it is from May 2000 – from the first three digits in the serial number, 00501412. It could date from 1990; I’m afraid I don’t know for sure which it is.

          You are right that ‘YP’ is yellow plate, and the ‘->5’ indicates where the back has an indent for prising it off, i.e. at the 5 0’clock position. The watch isn’t a diver, although it has a sporty design. The tachymeter bezel is used for measuring speed. If it were a diver it would have a bezel showing minutes and the dial would have a depth rating. The ‘water resist’ mark indicates that the case and crystal are designed to stop water getting, but it would only be at a basic level say when splashed in the rain – definitely not suitable for swimming, nor for showering in either!

          I’m really not sure about value – collectors aren’t looking for quartz models unless they are very early and/or very rare and/or ‘high end’. I can only suggest searching for similar watches and what they have sold for.

          Hope this helps a little,
          Stephen

  52. Melanie Athena says:

    Hi there Stephen, Thanks so much, you’ve been a huge help! I’d listed my watch on ebay, and added “diver” in the description only this morning, after having read so much abut there watches that seemed similar. Seemed being th operative word, LOL… anyway, about to go change the description now. Also good to know it isn’t waterproof… way to ruin a watch after it’s survived all those years! Anyway, thanks again, you are very generous and it is much appreciated, by many, I’m sure! And I’ll be on the lookout for a real citizen diver after all I’ve read here! All the best to you, Melanie

  53. игорь says:

    Привет,Стивен!Потрясающий блог!Спасибо!Помогите разобраться с моим Cinizen.Citizen Automatic WR-100 GN-4-S 8228-824423 TA-внутри корпуса,8228-815898-на циферблате.Какого года часы и качество образца? Заранее спасибо и мой Вам респект.Игорь Соколовский.Украина.

    • sweephand says:

      Привет,Игорь
      Спасибо за посещение моего блога и за ваши теплые комментарии 🙂 Ваши часы более поздние, чем я знаком с, но, насколько я знаю, это было сделано в период в 1990-х. Движения, 8228, представляет собой вариант 8200, Автомат, с окном в циферблате Показать спускового. Я считаю, она имеет стекло обратно, поэтому, вероятно, имеет серийный номер. Это означает, что мы не можем дать точную дату производства. Я не видел многие из них, поэтому я боюсь, что я не знаю, какие цены заплатил за них.

      Вот ссылка на ссылку сайт, который дает производство Дата как примерно в 1990 году для этого движения: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&Citizen_8228A

      И вот «Alterna» модель, которая выглядит иметь этого движения, от 1999 года: http://citizen.jp/discovery/model/1990lt/vo10-5665s.html

      Я надеюсь, это полезно, и что он-лайн переводчик сделал хорошую работу!

      Стивен

      [Hi Igor,
      thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment 🙂 Your watch is more recent than the period I am familiar with, but as far as I know it was made in the in the 1990s. The movement, 8228, is a version of the 8200 automatic, with a window in the dial to show the escapement. I believe it has a glass back, so probably has no serial number. This means we can not give an exact date of production. I have not seen many of these, so I am afraid that I do not know what kind of prices are paid for them.
      Here is a link which to a reference site that gives the production date as around 1990 for this movement: http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&0&2uswk&Citizen_8228A
      And here is an ‘Alterna’ model which looks to have this movement, dated 1999: http://citizen.jp/discovery/model/1990lt/vo10-5665s.html
      I hope this is helpful, and that the on-line translator has done a good job!]

  54. monique says:

    Hi Stephen!
    This is a very nice blog that you have. I enjoyed readind and learning about this watch. For example, the Citizen watch piled up in my souvenir boxes.. :from what I was told, I always thought that it was made prior to the 1960’s. From your blog though, I learned that it is more in the late 70’s as it has ‘water resistant’ encrypted (my english is not great so i hope I got this right).
    I would really appreciate if you can provide me with more details for my watch and also perhaps if you have an idea of its sale value as I entend to sell it (is ebay the best place?).
    It is a women watch, frame and bracelet are gold color. It has the day and date. 21 Jewel is marked on the front bottom with a picture of wings (red in the center) a flag (i think it’s wings but could be something else). On the front, top, ‘automatic’ is written under ‘citizen’.
    On the back:
    citizen watch co.
    water resistant
    base metal top
    stainless steel back
    4-280407 KT
    9083296
    74-7408
    japan
    GP
    Thank you so much! I appreciate all your help!

  55. monique says:

    Hi Stephen, I hope you had a very nice Christmas with your loved ones.
    Thank you for taking the time to read my post. Yes, the logo is the same.
    Monique

    • sweephand says:

      thank you Monique, I’ve had a very good Christmas – I hope the same goes for you. Thanks for confirming that your watch has the same emblem as the one in the link. You are right that they are wings, the emblem is a stylised eagle, and the watch is one of the ‘Eagle 7’ range of automatic watches Citizen first made in the 1980s. Many models were made, right through to the 1990s, using the 8200 automatic movement first produced in 1976. Very occasionally a different movement is found in these but it’s most likely an 8200. Yours is a gold plated model (‘GP’) over a ‘base metal’ (alloy) case. 4-280407 is the case number – frequently this will indicate the movement inside, but this one doesn’t. 74-7408 is the model number, which doesn’t help much these days without the relevant casing parts manual that a watch maker would use to check part numbers etc when doing a service or repair.

      9083296 is the serial number and this helps us date the watch. Due to this movement being used in the 1980s and 1990s, we have to make best guess about which year it was made, from the first digit in the serial number, i.e. ‘9’. I think, from the style of the case and model numbers, it is probably from 1989. ’08’ tells us it was made in August of that year. Although the 8200 calibre is a sound and reliable movement, it was not a high grade model, and many were sold so there are plenty to be found on eBay. Unfortunately their value is not great as a result.

      I hope this is helpful, and apologies for the delay in replying,
      Stephen

      • monique says:

        Thank you Stephen, I had a very nice Christmas and exceptionally warm (for Canada).
        I really appreciate all the information that you provided to me so quickly. Thank you again and congratulations on your great new acquisition!
        Happy New Year!
        Monique

  56. Bert says:

    Hi Stephan,

    First of all, thanks for this fantastic source of information. I can imagine maintaining your blog takes a huge effort so thanks very much for that.

    I have been a “Citizen early quartz diver guy” for many years but I am slowly converting to a “Citizen early automatic diver guy”. Your blog is a main reason for that.

    Recently, i struck gold and bought a B52806 from it’s first original owner. The outside looks rough and well used but dial and hands are spotless. These watches are so well constructed! Mine never got any moist into it I’m sure. It keeps perfect time and I’m in love with the Sweeping Hand…..

    Unfortunately, it does not have the original bracelet. Can you help me with that or show me the way to find one? Your help is much appreciated.

    All the best for the new year from Holland,
    Bert

    PS: if you need pictures of the watch for publication or your personal archive just let me know.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Bert, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments – much appreciated 🙂 Great to hear you have got hold of a B52806, one of the rarer 150m divers, and good to hear (though I’m not surprised!) that it is running well. Finding an original bracelet is a huge ask – I think we can identify what style it would have been, but then finding one with the appropriate curved end links is going to be very difficult. Let’s see what it might look like – I think there are three possible options that we can be fairly sure about. The B52806 was the export version of the the 62-5370 model, so first here’s a scan of a German catalog from the late 1960s showing a diver on a bracelet:

      There is no model or case number given though, but it is from the right time period.

      The 62-5370 has a case number of 4-540115, so second, here is a scan from a 1971 catalog showing one of these, with a different kind of bracelet:

      At least we know that this style was used on the same watch as yours, although this one is not the export version.

      Finally, here is a pic from my archives of a 62-5370 on a different style – I don’t know for sure if this was original to the watch, but that style was made in the 1960s and it looks to match the case:

      I have found an example of this last kind up for auction at the moment on Yahoo Japan. I’ll get an email to you with details.

      Stephen

  57. Waqas khan says:

    I liked all washes

  58. Michael Drochner says:

    Hi there!

    I am looking for technical drawings of a 5270 movement. Does anyone here have something on hand or does someone know, where I can find them? I already addressed Citizen Service in Germany – they told me they do not have drawings or parts…

    Thanks!
    Michael

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Michael – thanks for visiting my blog 🙂 Here are two schematics for the 52xx movement. If these are what you are looking for, you should be able to copy them. If you want me to email them to you please let me know.

      Stephen

  59. Michael says:

    Hi there,

    does anyone have an idea where I can find new crystals for 5270 (21 jewels): Twin Crowns Divers?
    They seem to be very special…

    Thanks,
    Michael

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Michael – it’s very difficult indeed to find any oem parts for these. The crystal is a plastic one, so can be polished effectively if it’s not scratched too deeply or cracked. The part number for your divers is 54-0145, but I can’t find any supply of these. Original crystals for vintage Citizens can be found on Yahoo Japan, but nothing on there at the moment for yours. I’m checking one other possible source but I don’t hold out much hope I’m afraid.

      Stephen

  60. Eric Etter says:

    I have a gn- 4w- a, wondering what it might be worth.
    80603103

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Eric, thanks for visiting my blog. ‘GN’ code is the case type, so that doesn’t identify the model. Can you let me know what other numbers are on the case back please, e.g. case number – 4-xxxxxx and /or model number xx-xxxx, and what other markings are there, and on the dial. Thanks,

      Stephen

  61. Paul Sherwood says:

    Hi Steve
    Can you get in touch via my email, I have a few corrections for this reference page.
    Cheers Paul “1386paul”

  62. Martog says:

    Hi Paul /Steven, glad you caught up and sorted out the corrections that were needed.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mark – Paul’s been a great help in getting the page amended and updated. I confess that the divers are not my most familiar territory. Just need an image now of an orange 62-6198 and a fully correct blue dialled 52-0110…..

      Stephen

  63. Liam Sullivan says:

    Hi I was looking through my grandpa’s old chest and I found a watch and I want to know what year it is are and what is it’s value. (this one I could not find anything about)

    citizen watch co.
    water resist
    Base metal YP
    4-039335SMK
    10300251
    GN-4w-s

    • Liam Sullivan says:

      it’s also a 21 jewel automatic

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Liam, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch has the 8200 automatic movement inside. These movements were made for over 30 years so it is difficult to pin down the year of production. So unfortunately I can only say it was made either in March 1981 or March 1991. Although the movement is sound and reliable in good condition, they are often sold on eBay and don’t have great deal of value I’m afraid. If you search eBay, for example with ‘vintage Citizen 21 jewels’ you can get an idea of what they go for.

      Stephen

  64. samu says:

    Hi Stephen
    I have 68-5372 with red date and 67-5776 orange diver with original orange bezel
    I will send you pics
    please email me!

  65. Savy says:

    Hello, Found this page so interesting. I’m using my Grandfathers old watch, since you have such vast knowledge (read almost all of your replies!) i would like to know more about it. You could email me i can even send u pictures of it. just 2 years back i found it in his drawer. and it works fine. a mechanic even checked it and said it will work for a guaranteed 30 years more. Its an automatic.It means a lot to me.
    on the back this is what is written:-
    CITIZEN WATCH.CO
    4-063155 SM
    0 1 0 6 6 5 6 2
    GN-4-S
    71-2159

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Savio – thanks for visiting my blog, and I’m glad you have found it interesting. It’s great to hear that you are using your Grandfather’s watch 🙂 I think you have an ‘Eagle 7’ model, and I’d be very happy to see photos so I’ll send an email.

      Stephen

  66. Martin says:

    Hi Stephen. The web pages are a great resource, well done & thanks. Could you help me identify a watch from a description. As a child I was given a very small mechanical divers watch, this would be about 1974. Stainless case, black face, mechanical, but not automatic. Rotating bezel. The rear was engraved with the outline of a diver, but not a diver armed with a spear gun. The watch was really very small (I would have been 8 years old). Could this have been a Citizen watch?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Martin, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments. I’m afraid I don’t know of a Citizen diver that fits the description – the only diver engraving I know of is the one on the page, with spear gun I think the only hand winding diver was a ladies watch, called a ‘Date Seine’which had a fairly plain back:

      I hope you can find your watch – it sounds cool to have had a diver model when you were just 8 years old! 🙂

      Stephen

  67. Martin says:

    thanks for the reply Stephen. It’s not the ladies watch you have shown. It was really very small. I am a little surprised I was given it. I had wanted one for some reason (who knows why a child wants something) but there were lots of things I wanted but life wasn’t like that back then. Years later my mother told me she had searched all over looking for a divers watch small enough for me. The watch had a hard life and I lost it years ago. But my memory of it was that it was good quality. I am very curious to know what it was.

  68. Richard says:

    Never realised what high regard my old citizen diver 52-0110 was held in! Bought it in 1978 in Schipol Airport Duty-Free on my way to my first Red Sea dive. Been wearing it every day since and it still keeps good time. Serviced only once. Literally just now replaced the original bezel insert with a repro one from Crystaltimes. Looks great! New PU rubber and s/s oyster bracelet on their way. Just bought myself an Invicta as a replacement. Shouldn’t have bothered. That will be a dress watch but the Citizen will carry on as my everyday “tool” watch. Had a lifetime of great adventures all over the world with it. 🙂

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Richard, thanks for visiting my blog – it’s great to hear from someone who has owned his watch form new 🙂 Mark beat me to it – we want pics! And maybe some more stories about where you’ve dived with it…..

      If you would be kind enough to share pics, you aren’t able to post them direct here, but can link to somewhere if you have uploaded them. Otherwise I an email you and you can send them to me to upload. Let me know if you want to do that.
      Stephen

  69. Martog says:

    Hi Richard after such a big write up like. that how about some pictures of your beauty. A life time of adventures is worth a couple of pic;s

    Cheers
    Mark

  70. Audun says:

    There is a 100 m 520343 with straight hourchand for sale at ebay now, I motiver you only had an ad showing this watch

  71. chuck pratt says:

    i have a citizen crystal seven i cant find any information on, maybe you can help, on the back it says parameter, star, ACSS2904-Y, S.S.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Chuck, thanks for visiting my blog. Citizen made a range of Crystal Sevens in the mid to late 1960s, using the 52 family of movements. These are good quality movements running at 18,000 beats per hour, and were fitted with hardened mineral glass, hence the ‘crystal’ name, and had day and date windows. If you can let me know how many jewels it has I should be able to tell you exactly which movement is inside. In good condition they run very accurately – I’ve just worn one of mine for nearly two weeks and not had to adjust it – here’s a piece on it which also gives more info about these watches: https://sweep-hand.org/2011/06/23/this-weeks-featured-watch-8-the-crystal-seven-27-jewels/

      Yours should have an eight figure serial number on the back – the first number in it gives the year of production and since these were only made in the 1960s this will tell you exactly which year (they were first made in 1965).

      Stephen

      • chuck pratt says:

        It is 27 jewels with sn 70700574 with gn below that, thank you

        • sweephand says:

          So it’s from July 1967 – in fact the movement could be one of four versions, all of which had 27 jewel variants – 5201, 5202, 5203, 5204 – the only way to tell is to take the back off and the number will be stamped near the balance wheel. ‘GN’ is the case type code which means it is a water resistant design with a screw down back.

          Stephen

  72. Peter D says:

    Hi Stephen, perhaps you can help me with additional information about my black dialed “commando” branded compressor style citizen from 1969. 4-520343 Y, 61-5111, dial 520766-D, ser 912xxxxx. Though the hour and minute and seem conventional, the second hand is unusual in that it has the ball with pointer, not just the ball. All the lume seems consistent in color and luminescence brightness/ decay. There appear to be two holes where the citizen badge might ordinarily have been mounted underneath the commando label. The only similar photograph I could find is one I think you’re familiar with on an old moon dater. I hope you can view the photos here:
    http://photobucket.com/share/email?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs284.photobucket.com%2Fuser%2Flpdand%2Flibrary%2FMobile%2520Uploads%3Fsrc%3Dpb

    Thanks!
    Peter

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Peter, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is certainly interesting – that type of second hand is used on another twin crown diver but it is a different model, with case number 4-521315. The standard one on the 4-520343 has, as you know, the lume ball at the end. However I have seen it on one other 61-5111 so it’s quite possible that this is an original fitting. The ‘Commando’ brand on the dial is something of a puzzle. I have seen the Moon Dater before, where it is printed in place of the usual applied Citizen logo. I’m afraid I’m not convinced yours is an original, i.e. factory made, design. I wouldn’t have thought that Citizen would use a dial that had been pierced for the normal Citizen logo to be applied, so that the holes remain visible. Also the ‘Commando’ logo is printed over the vertical cross hair line and is not centred over the gap in the line where the applied logo would normally sit. These things suggest to me a later modification, since Citizen would have produced it to a better quality as seen on the Moon Dater.

      Stephen

  73. Emre says:

    Hi Stephen,
    What a lovely blog with lots of information hard to find and put together, thanks for your effort.
    I have a 62-6198. It was given to me by my uncle, I made a whole cleaning and was lucky enough to find a brand new bezel insert and glass from eBay. Relume applied now, I’m wearing with pride.
    The serial is 51100373, it’s made on November 1975, am I right?
    All the best from istanbul
    Emre

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Emre, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comments. Your watch sounds very nice – I assume you got the after market bezels and crystals from ‘Crystaltimes’, they are very good quality. You’re exactly right about the production date 🙂 Did your uncle buy it when it was new?

      Stephen

      • Emre says:

        Hi Stephen,

        Yes actually my uncle bought it brand new, then when he purchased a submariner :), citizen moved to me :))
        By the way, yes I noticed sadly that the bezel insert is after market and not NOS after I purchased it. I still keep the originals but don’t want to use them, cause the pearle is almost gone and the rest is quite scratched.
        Would you like to have some photos? I didnt see a way to publish on your blog.

        Emre

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Emre – an original bezel insert would be just about impossible to find. The after market ones are very good and made to the original specs. It would be great to see pics, but I’m afraid visitors can’t post pics here, only I can do that. If you have uploaded the pics somewhere you can post a link, or I can email you and you could send them to me to upload.

          Stephen

  74. Rick says:

    I sure learned a lot from this blog/site!
    I have mostly American and Swiss made watches but when I see an older affordable Citizen or Seiko I jump on it. Last one was a Citizen diver model number 62-6198 in pretty good condition but someone had stuck an acrylic crystal down in the case on top of the original crystal gasket. I measured the gasket and ordered a mineral glass crystal 31.3mm x 2.5mm and installed it. The 2.5mm crystal was the thickest one the supply house had in tenths of a mm. They have 3.0mm thick crystals but they only come in even sizes…31.0mm, 32.0mm etc.

    Here is the problem…the top of the crystal is about 1.5mm below the top surface of the bezel insert. Is this the way it is supposed to be? I can not tell if there is this much space above the crystal from the pictures of similar models.
    Any help would be appreciated.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Rick, thanks for visiting my blog and I’m glad that you are finding it useful. The crystal on the 62-6198 should be slightly raised above the bezel as far as I know. Here are a couple of pics that may help:


      You can get a replacement specifically made for this diver from eBay, item number: 351384746251

      Stephen

  75. Rick says:

    Thank you for the tip! I ordered a crystal for it along with a new bezel insert and will keep the old insert to go with the watch if I sell it. The watch was made in February 1976 and is the first one I can remember seeing for sale locally (TN).

  76. Desperate says:

    Sweet blog-post! Lots of useful information and conversations – and still active. Thanks for that, sweephand.
    Of course i have a question as well, hope somebody can help. Is there a search term for the balance hairspring of the Citizen 6001 movement that could help me searching this as a spare part? An already assembled balance set would be good as well. Maybe there are even hairsprings of other manufactures an calibers that would fit?

    All hints (besides “go scavenge e-bay for the same caliber” – which i do already) are welcome.

    Cheers
    Desperate

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Desperate (Dan?) – thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. I’ll try to help – what is the model of the watch you have that needs the parts, is it the 62-6198 diver?

      Stephen

  77. Jordan says:

    Hi,
    Great blog and info!

    I was hoping you could help ID the date this Citizen quartz diver was made.

    On the back it says: 340141, GN -4-8, 2510-8004501.

    Watch face has: Japan mvmt/ 2510-8008081 KA

  78. Bart says:

    Hi Stephen,

    I just received my blue diver 61-5773 parawater from 1969 and am very enthousiatic about it.

    You wrote “Case Number: APSS 52904-Y (23j) or 4-520858 Y (21j, export ‘proof’ model)” however just wanted to let you know that mine is tagged 4-520858 Y while it has 23 jewels and seven star, so the information is incorrect I guess…

    [IMG]http://i61.tinypic.com/auwa39.jpg[/IMG]

    Cheers,
    Bart

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Bart – thank you for visiting and your comment. Nice to see your watch, and also very helpful to see that it is a 23 jewel version with that case number. I’ve just found another example on Yahoo Japan which confirms exactly what you are telling me 🙂 SO I have made a correction to the page to include 23 jewels against case number 4-520858. It’s always good that other people’s knowledge contributes to this blog, it’s what I’ve always intended. Thanks again,

      Stephen

  79. Howard H says:

    Hi Stephen

    I’ve just happenchanced across this Japanese site at http://www.wa.commufa.jp/~bunta/div.html – where there’s some great pix of vintage Citizen (and Seiko 6215) divers including a couple of 40 metre parawater Auto Daters. Worth a look .

    Thanks for both an interesting and informative reference site.

    Best wishes – Howard

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Howard – thanks for visiting my blog and for posting the link. I know that site very well – some stunning and very rare pieces to be found 🙂

      Stephen

  80. Mark H says:

    I have an older Citizen, probably from 1970’s. On the back: 4-310051 Y; Parawater S.S. 90512717. On the front: Citizen Alarm Date; 21 jewels. It’s in fair condition, has surface scratches. As far as I know, everything is original , no repairs. Has been in a drawer for the last 30 years. Can you tell me anything about it? Where can I find approximate value?
    Thank you,
    Mark

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mark, thank you for visiting my blog 🙂 Your alarm date is from May 1969 (from first three number in the serial number). Citizen used a Swiss design for their alarm watches, first producing them in 1958 with the ’98’ movement, later using the ’31’ version, as in yours, from 1964. The same design was later used by the Russian manufacturer ‘Poljot’. ‘4-310051’ is the case number, but I can’t find any images of it on the internet – have you any photos uploaded that you could post a link to? (I’m afraid you can’t post any pics here directly). Vintage alarm watches are collectable, especially in good condition. The best way to get some idea of value is to search eBay (including ‘completed listings’) to see if you can find a similar model – ‘vintage Citizen alarm’ should get some results. Stainless steel will usually have higher value these days than gold plated ones.

      Stephen

      • chuck pratt says:

        Hello, i have a 1967 crystal seven that no longer works, i sent it off through kay jewelers to have it repaired and it cant be done because the parts have been discontinued, do you have any recomendations as to where or how to get it working again, thanks chuck in alabama

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Chuck – probably the best way to source parts is to find a donor watch. Do you know what parts are needed? Movement parts are probably easier to find than casing parts which are specific to the model, for example dial and hands. Which model and case is it (model number is in form of ’12-3456′, case number is ‘4-123456’)?

          Stephen

          • chuck pratt says:

            No they didnt specifiy whick parts were needed, im pretty sure they didnt even open the watch. I dont see any numbers in that format, S.S. parawater star ACSS2904-Y in the outer ring on case back and Crystal seven automatic 70700574 gn in the center, hope this helps

            • sweephand says:

              Hi Chuck – your watch has the older style of model number (ACSS2904). This was also given two later case numbers for stainless steel – 4-520459 and 4-521625, and also a gold plated model: 4-520475. 70700574 is the serial number, giving a production date of July 1967. I can recommend Brian Leiser, whose work is featured on my blog, for service – I don’t know whether he can get Crystal Seven (i.e. 52 movement) parts, but donors can be found. Let me know if you want his contact details.

              Stephen

  81. Ray cox says:

    Hi,

    I have had a watch for many years and wondering if you could provide me with a value of what it potentially worth.

    It’s a sweeping hand citzen watch the small code at bottom of the face is p8200-812061-y

    Many thanks
    Ray

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Ray, thanks for visiting my blog. Although the dial code tells me that your watch has the 8200 automatic movement inside, it would be helpful to have some more information. Can you please tell me what else is on the dial, and particularly what is stamped on the case back,
      thanks,
      Stephen

  82. al says:

    Hey guys, came across a weird citizen that I some questions about. It an ice hockey citizen. The second hand is a hockey player that goes around the perimeter of the face. It has a big 77 on the face. It also has Tokyo and ice hockey on the face. Its an automatic. On the back it says Mr. Japan. Maybe you guys can tell me something about it because I can’t find anything. Thanks.

  83. Rich says:

    Hi, great site, glad to have found it.
    I collect many Citizens, mainly Divers, having many Promaster’s over the time, but I recently went for ‘7’ , just to see what they are like against a few of my Seiko 5’s and Orient 3 stars.

    This came for ebay and I’ve yet to receive it in terms of getting a caseback picture, but would you be able to help with any info on model, age etc?

    Any info would be gratefully received.

    Many thanks, Rich, UK

    http://s653.photobucket.com/user/TheEmperorMing/media/_571.jpg.html

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Rich, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comment. Apologies for my slow reply. The Eagle 7 range is a bit later than the focus of my collection, but I can tell you that the 8200 automatic movement was first produced in 1976, and soon became Citizen’s workhorse mechanical automatic watch. It was produced for over 30 years, so they can be difficult to date – the Eagle 7’s are no earlier than 1980, but they were made through to the 1990, so yours will be from that period. Please let me know what’s on the case back when you receive the watch, and we may be able to pin it down more accurately.

      Stephen

  84. Harry Bradshaw says:

    Hi Stephen,
    Congratulations on a great website and blogg, it is highly informative.
    I was hoping you could help me in relation to an old Citizen diving watch which my father gave to me on my 18th birthday in 1973.
    The front shows it is a Citizen ChronoMaster, Chronometer – Para500Mwater -33J The rear states it is a SS Parawater Citizen 4-540263.
    It is still working and was used constantly in my younger days whilst diving, the band is non original and the bezel has scratches from use.
    Is this a watch I should pass on to my son or is it worth selling?

    http://s1039.photobucket.com/user/harry20326/media/Citizen%20Watch/Watch%20face_zpsrkwg1zlf.jpg.html
    http://s1039.photobucket.com/user/harry20326/media/Citizen%20Watch/Rear%20watch%20close%20up_zpsmvwzfyby.png.html

    Best Regards
    Harry

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Harry, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments. Your diver is a rare and very collectable piece. It is rarely seen for sale, and is particularly interesting since it holds Citizen’s high end, chronometer rated 33 jewel movement and is rated to an impressive 500m. I’m not a diver expert, but I don’t think there are many ‘officially certified’ chronometer divers. In terms of sale value, this model is definitely valuable, although the condition of the bezel insert will affect value, as will the engraving on the back – many collectors prefer not to see engraving other than the original marks, so it’s hard to be precise. Correct case parts would be nigh on impossible to find. Having said that, one of these with an incorrect bezel (the metal part as well as the insert) sold on eBay for over $2000 (over £1300) a couple of years ago, and I saw a correct but broken one sell on Yahoo Japan for over $4000 (over £2600). If you were to sell, then alerting collectors beforehand would be a good idea – there are not too many such people so this is generally not a well known model. Hope this helps!

      Stephen

  85. Harry Bradshaw says:

    Thank you Stephen for your quick response.
    Your comments about value have blown me away, I will now consider trying to sell it, do you have any clues on how I could alert collectors and would ebay be the best method. For your info I reside in Australia.
    Kind regards
    Harry

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Harry – besides this blog there are a couple of forums and another blog where mention could be made of your watch. Ebay is the obvious choice for an open auction, especially if you want to get to a worldwide market, although it’s a shame there’s no Japanese eBay since there are Citizen collectors there. There are risks with Ebay auctions of course, especially with a valuable item, so another option is to see if any collectors are interested first. You’d have to determine a selling price, and be careful to get references for any potential buyer. There are a few people I’m aware of in Australia who collect Citizens and / or divers, but I don’t know whether they have budgets available!

      Stephen

  86. Sanjeev Rana says:

    Hi Stefan,
    Great blog and info!

    I was hoping you could help ID the date this Citizen Automatic 21 Jewels was made.

    On the back it says:
    CITIZEN
    Watch Co.
    4-063058 SMT
    91138026
    72-0577

  87. yakuda15 says:

    Hi everbody,
    I have one.

    Case Nr. : 4-610512 Y
    Model Nr. 64-7551
    Ser. Nr. : 9111647

    My watch (I don’t know how can to post images.)
    https://onedrive.live.com/?id=CF316BE86A2872F8%21314&cid=CF316BE86A2872F8

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Yakuda – only I am allowed to post pics directly on my blog, but your link is fine 🙂 Your watch is a women’s model, which was known in Japan as a ‘Cosmostar Date’. Yours is an export model since the dial isn’t marked with that name, and is marked ‘waterproof’ rather than ‘parawater’. The ‘waterproof’ mark tells us it was not made later than about 1972 or 1973, so the serial number gives a production date of November, 1969 (‘911’). The 6600 21 jewel hand winding high best movement in these is a real gem, running at 28,800 beats per hour, it has a smoothly sweeping second hand and is capable of very accurate time-keeping.

      Stephen

  88. yakuda15 says:

    Why I can’t see my post?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Yakuda – thanks for visiting my blog. Since this is a blog, not a forum where people have to sign up to the rules and register, I have to approve first comments before they appear, so there can be a delay sometimes.

      Stephen

  89. Bert says:

    Hi Kelvin, i’m interesested in your watch too !!! ⌚️
    All the best, Bert

    • Kelvin says:

      Hi Bert.
      I will sell the watch as my family have now decided they will let me!
      Trusted buyers only, no eBay/Paypal nonsense.
      Value?
      Open to genuine offers, plus shipping.

  90. Louis says:

    Hi can you please tell me how old is the citizen 62-5213 automatic 4-540077 T i got it from my grand Farther after he past away and would like to know more about it
    Thanks

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Louis, thanks for visiting my blog. Your watch is from the late 1960s. Is there a serial number on the back? If so it will probably have be an 8 figure number. We can date it exactly from that.

      Stephen

  91. David Reith says:

    Hi, really enjoyed reading the blog. Never realized that Citizen had so many cool vintage watches. I have a Citizen Automatic with 21 jewels. it has a greenish gold face with date only. There are no numbers on the face. Just raised gold blocks. The watch is rectangular with a round face. Around the edges on the back, it says Water Resistant, Citizen, Automatic. The back face has the following: CGP, 6000, 4-600657Y, 40902067, 62-6465. On the metal band on the end of the clasp there is an owl stamped into the metal. The watch is working but after running 13 hours it is 35 minutes fast. Any information you can share is appreciated. The watch was found in a box after a family member passed and nobody knows anything about it.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi David – thanks for visiting my blog, and glad that you have enjoyed it 🙂

      Your watch has the 6000 (date only) movement inside, which is a very nice calibre produced in the early 1970s. 4-600657 is the case number, also indicating a 6000 movement, and 62-6465 is the model number. Again, ’62’ was used for 6000 movement models. CGP tells us that the case is gold plated. The first three figures in the serial number – 40902067 – tell us that it was made in September 1974. I’m not sure about the ‘owl’ motif on the clasp, so that sounds like it is a placement for the original bracelet or strap. These movements run at 21,600 beats per hour, and in good condition they are reliable and accurate. Since the watch is running, it may just need a thorough clean and service to sort it out – dried up old oil may be causing the fast running. Although this is not a particularly valuable model, if it has sentimental value then a service may well get it back in good order and capable of use as a daily or occasional wearer. You would need to find a watchmaker who is familiar with vintage mechanical watches to ensure it is looked after properly.

      Stephen

    • David Reith says:

      Thanks for the quick reply. I will look into taking it to a qualified watchmaker. Since the value is sentimental I will not feel bad about changing the band and enjoying the watch as one of my daily wearers.

  92. Johan says:

    Hi!
    Very interesting blog!
    I just took out two old Citizen watches from a drawer and now I am thinking of if I should start to use them again.
    One is an 80s Divers so I guess it is not of your interest but the other one is an old automatic marked 4-600851 Y and is for sure a 70s watch. I put it away as the automatic function was not working. Do you know if there could be a possibility to mend it or not or maybe there are similar watches for sale at a decent price? (My is rather scratched as I used it in my teens.) Br /Johan

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Johan, thanks for visiting my blog. With case number of 4-600851 you have a 150m diver from the mid-1970s, like this example:

      This model uses Citizen’s 6001 movement, running at 21,600 beats per hour. As with Citizen’s other 150m divers from that period, these are of great interest to collectors, so finding another one in decent condition will be quite an expensive option. It may well be possible to repair your watch – I guess it would be good to get yours up and running again after owning from your teens, and it is possible to find movement parts. Case parts are another story though, and it’s the opposite with them – they are (very) hard to find especially in good condition. There is one very good after market bezel insert and crystal available from time to time – not original of course but if yours are very worn and you want it to be more wearable (whilst keeping the original ones safe from further damage of course) then that is an option.

      It’s possible that the auto winding rotor has come loose – can you hear anything rattling around? Sounds like it needs to be looked at by a good watchmaker who knows vintage mechanicals – the 6001 movement is a good one, so it may just need a thorough clean and service.

      Stephen

  93. Koimaster says:

    Great article. A lot of thought and research in it. I have posted this link at the forum and invite people here to stop by or join the only uncensored watch forum. We have a lot of watch lovers there.

  94. Tan Huy says:

    Hello Mr. Stephen,

    Thanks for your great blog about vintage Citizen watch
    Pleased give me some information about this watch
    Citizen watch 4-653149K water resistan 50I All stainless steel 50301027
    And Citizen watch 4-520068T parawater automatic S.S G-N-3U 90200032
    Thank you very much

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Tan, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. From the case and serial numbers you’ve provided here’s what I can tell you:
      1) 4-653149 – I believe this is an automatic with day and date complications and the 6501 movement inside. First produced in 1971 this 21 jewel movement runs at 21,600 beats per hour and was often used with colourful dials and innovative case designs / materials. The serial number gives a production date of March 1975, and ‘water resistant’ had become the term by that time. Here’s a post on my example for more information: https://sweep-hand.org/2011/10/19/this-weeks-featured-watch-15-6501-with-tungsten-bezel/
      2) 4-520068 – I think this is a Seven Star (deluxe?) model, with one of the 52 movements inside. This movement was first produced in 1965 and was used in the Crystal Seven and Seven Star lines. It runs at 18,000 beats per hour and has date and day complications. Yours is from February 1969. ‘Parawater’ was used by Citizen for ‘waterproof’ at that time, before watch manufacturers had to change to resistant in the early 1970s. Please let me know if I’m right about it being a Seven Star – if it isn’t then I guess it will be a Crystal Seven!

      Stephen

      • Tan Huy says:

        thank for your quick reply,
        your information are right, 2 watch are automatic too, and have day and date. Thank for your blog, i can guess exactly when they are made. two of them to day are still very good and beautiful, on time. Im very happy.
        this is really useful blog. Thạnks a lot from Vietnam.

  95. Hi Mr. Stephen,
    I am really amazed to see this great blog on
    classic vintage CITIZENS …
    I have inherited a black color watch and sadly, I know
    nothing about this unique piece I am having…
    I wanted to get information about that Citizen watch.
    Inside the back case, it shows:
    ………………………….
    CITIZEN WATCH
    8200A UNADJUSTED
    21 JEWELS
    JAPAN
    ………………………….
    and on the case it is written as
    ………………………….
    CITIZEN
    WATER RESISTANT
    4-282080 KT (or RT maybe)
    1 1 0 0 4 8 7 3
    71 – 2831
    GH – 4 – 5
    ……………
    Sir I would be thankful to know about this unique watch, its manufacturing year its cost
    and all that stuff related to this …
    I would be waiting for your response …
    God Bless You 🙂

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Hassaan, thank you for visiting my blog, and for your very kind comment. Your watch is an automatic, using the 8200 movement which was first produced around 1976. This movement was used for over 30 years, as it became Citizen’s ‘workhorse’ mechanical automatic. There’s more information for you here:
      https://sweep-hand.org/2013/01/27/the-8200-movement-citizens-standard-auto/

      The marks on the back are the case number (4-282080) and the model number (71–2831) and these are typical of a watch with the 8200 movement. I think ‘GH–4–5’ is actually ‘GN-4-S’ which is the case type code, indicating a water resistant case and crystal design, with a screw down back. I’m pretty sure that yours is from October 1981 – this is taken from the first three figures in the serial number – 11004873. Serial numbers with eight figures like this are usually from earlier production years. I don’t know what these watches would have cost when they were first sold, and I’m afraid they don’t have any great value these days, since over the years very many were made so they are not rare these days. In good condition the movement is a strong and reliable one, capable of accurate time-keeping.

      Stephen

  96. Jonas says:

    Hi. Do you know where to get hands to a Citizen 62-6198.

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jonas – I’m afraid I don’t. I don’t know anywhere that would have these, so the best advice I can give is to check for junk watches on eBay and if you are lucky enough to find one, get the hands re-lumed.

      Stephen

  97. artali786 says:

    I have a citizen watch GN-4-S model 4-039181 SMT, can some one the year of make?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi, thanks for visiting my blog. Some more information would help if you have it – can you please let me know what other marks are on the case back, especially if there is a number with 6, 7 or 8 figures in it. Also, can you please describe the dial and what markings are on it, andif there is a very small number printed beneath the 6 o’clock marker,
      Stephen

  98. Mitch Bari says:

    Hi,
    I’m wondering what diver model is Mathew McConaughey wearing in the HBO series True Detective? Thanks

  99. oldempirellc says:

    Came across your site and wanted to share. I have a 4-520858 Y, 21j, export ‘proof’ model with an ORANGE dial in (more or less) mint shape (bar few scratches on the crystal). Yes, the hands are identical to the blue one above. I will be glad to donate few scans for your archive. Great job on documenting wonderful watches!

    Out of curiosity, how rare are the ‘proof’ models?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Vlad, thanks for visiting my site, and good to see you have one of the orange models. All variants of these watches are fairly rare, and the proof ones are scarcer than the parawater models I believe, so it’s a rare model. Thank you for offering scans for the archive, that would be great and very much appreciated, it will help make the diver page as comprehensive as possible. I’ll email you so you can send images – thanks again, Stephen

  100. Hi I have a Citizen 63-1230 with 1800 Homer movement. The seria no is 40605399 and the case back has 4-1805515M. Could you pls help me with the date of manufacture and some more info on the movement.

  101. koimaster says:

    I see several of my forum members took my advice and dropped by including Jason_recliner. I have numerous links to your site and articles on the forum. I consider this the gold standard in regards to the information on Citizen watches. Drop by some time. http://www.watchlords.com

    Koimaster aka Alain

  102. Hi Stephen. I recently found a citizen automatic watch in my closet.Can u help me with the dating of the watch, also it’ll be great if you’d be able to give some additional info.
    Thanks,
    Dial : P-8200-989870-KY
    Back : 4-283449 KT
    60701507
    71-3759
    GN-4W-S

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Swapnil, thanks for visiting my blog, and apologies for my slow reply. Your watch has the 8200 day and date automatic movement. The ‘P’ in the dial code indicates that Promethium lume was used, whilst GN-4W-S is the case type code, indicating a water resistant case and crystal design. The case number – 4-283449 – and the model number – 71-3759 – are both typical of 8200 automatics. This movement was first made in 1975/6 and I think yours is from July 1986.
      Stephen

  103. Babis says:

    Hi many thanks for the info about citizen watches …
    i have an old citizen automatic (i remember) from argos UK, the watch has few scratches as is been used daily for swimming, gym, digging in farm, building work and in general almost any activity, using it more than 10 years daily (& still work by now at time writing (just was on the side for something like 10 years or so, as turned into the casio g-shocks)…perhaps due to heavy activity (hand’s activity at most times) it was about 5 minutes a head each month
    is exact this one here
    http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/citizen-21-jewel-eagle-automatic-day-244736884

    …but if can be find approximately a date was made will be great
    CITIZEN WATCH CO
    WATER RESIST
    STAINLESS
    4-R12021 RC
    865781
    GN-4-S

    at the front has an eagle, inside the eagle & at the middle a number 7 in red (eagle 7) and under the number 6 (right at the end) a very small letters 8200-xxxxxx …also saying WR100 … 21 jewels …it has the day with 2 languages & date

    many thanks for your time

  104. Babis says:

    Hi again, UPDATE … first please accept my apologies … i suppose to post at ” Want to know when your vintage Citizen watch was made?” but at time had too many browsers opened, looking for info & posted at wrong topic
    I have to say many many thanks for all the info you have, because i have learned few informations from your blog & so from You!

    At same time i have asked Citizen UK (where originally purchased in UK) & they answered fast!!!
    Credit to their Service Center !!!
    They believe was made since 1998 (which seems right to me because i was in UK at 1993/4 and purchased few years later, but was not remembering what year) the specific shop was a big store and they do not keep outdated watches, if they will be some old at the stock, they are going for sale and so their items are out of stock fairly fast, so i am sure Citizen has the correct date)
    And also to mention they told me, there are not any parts for it, if ever needs to be repaired

    My good mate at that time had a Casio 5 which he had to take it at their service center 2 times for repair and finally 3rd time the Seiko passed its life did not worked any longer after some years of daily use … the Citizen still works for me and had really bad use (even dropped at floor few times etc)

    However now i am wearing it again after very long time, is going fast about 60+ seconds a day (not sure because down here in Greece i am now, is 34C hot and high temperature matters) so i guess will take it to a local shop for some regulation because seems the specific automatic watch, has some more long time (hopefully) to run ok its mechanism
    From a quick testing, have find out that if i keep it stand vertical (facing the front of the watch) does not gaining time, but is impossible to keep it at this position all day or night time as i do not take it out of my hand (never any watch)

    I do like the mechanical automatic watches and now is back at my hand even has a lot of scratches over the years … i have removed the casio pro sports (compass, temperature, pressure etc) & g-shock series & if the regulation will be successful will be at my hand for long time again

    Again may many thanks for your time & for all the infos you are providing ! ☺… all the best and i will keep watching your blog

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Babis – thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments. I agree with Citizen UK that your watch is from (June) 1998. I would think that your watch is in need of a service, although regulation alone might get it running more accurately again. Although high temperatures will have some effect on accuracy I would think it would only be small and not result in a noticeable change. I think the 8200 was originally made to run at +/- 15 seconds per day, but they can be adjusted to much better than that. Good luck with it and I hope it gives you many more years of service 🙂
      Stephen

      • Babis says:

        Thanks again for time … i have some info for the citizen readers may find interesting (at their own risk if they will try similar attempt) … & hope links posted are fine, if not please remove everything and accept my apologies … once started the discuss, i have a final update…
        because the watch was on sale something around just £50 (on sale but brand new at time) & because the local shop wanted slightly less for a general service & regulation, i decided to just to regulate it by my self
        So based on this link

        & this one
        http://www.watchfreeks.com/454291-post7.html
        i opened the case and after about 16 or so attempts (is hard to get it correct trying with blind spots) i managed to get it at +2 seconds with in 10 hrs … yoooo hooooo … so hopefully after an other 10 hours should be 2 more seconds ahead and the other 4 hours (to complete 24 hours in total) expecting 1-2 more second ahead … hopefully will be around 5-6 max seconds a day for the caliber 8200
        (note the bad bangings and hits has even the g-shock,)

        NOTE > i know by now is possible for more accurate but open/close the case so many times & trying blind spots hits, i think that’s it, is fine there, compare was going fast 1+ minute a day
        So yea this little machine is back at the hand after about 18 years

        Just to write my personal opinion (so i may be wrong) about regulating … i have find out that the small part of the regulation that needs adjustment, is SO sensitive (moves so easy) … that i believe due to too many hard crashes my watches had & still has, i think over the years crash-crash each time, moved easy (but slightly each bang) and caused the faster timing in my case

        Many thanks, and for all citizen users long last their watches, my regards to all readers

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Babis, thanks for the update and congrats on having a go at regulating your watch. It is a fairly easy process, but can take a lot of attempts to get it as accurate as possible, but well worth the effort and patience needed. Thanks for the links, I’m sure others will find them useful.
          Stephen

  105. Jose mendez says:

    Hello can you help me to identify my watches,please?
    How can i send you a email?
    This is mine….

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Jose – thanks for visiting my blog. I’ve removed your email address sice this is a pblic blog, and I see your email when you make a comment. I’ll get an email to you 🙂

  106. Christos says:

    Hello there. I have a vintage citizen automatic, decade 1980, i want to find his value. Any ideas how? regards

  107. Balaji says:

    Hi Stephen,
    Good day. I came across a citizen watch that belongs to my dad. It was not maintained well, but what surprised me is that its still ticking without requiring any repair work. This has made me a fan of mechanical watches and is veering me away form the craze of smart watches.

    I am trying to find out the model and date the production. your help in this regard is highly appreciated. I am writing down all that i seen on the back case
    4-72102 Y
    Automatic
    01020110
    67-5075

    Citizen | Stainless Steel | GN – 1-5 | PARAWATER

    on the watch dial I see

    Citizen
    Automatic

    21 Jewels

    kindly help in identifying the model and year of production and any further literature about this model. Thanks in advance

    regards,
    Balaji

  108. Chuck says:

    Hello, can you help with the identification of my Citizen watches?
    https://www.zonerama.com/Chuck47/Album/2292394
    I apologize for my bad English, I use Google Translator 🙂

  109. Kole says:

    any info about this one. thanks
    [img]https://s19.postimg.org/5vboa0zdv/originalslika_Citizen_119531603.jpg[/img]
    [img]https://s19.postimg.org/aihqbsmqr/originalslika_Citizen_119531599.jpg[/img]

  110. Alessio says:

    Hello Stephen,

    I’m really amazed to see this blog! It’s full of really interesting info about citizen watches! I really wonder how you could possibly know all of this…
    So, maybe I have an interesting challenge for you…let’s see if you know more then citizen uk.
    I bet you do!
    My father has just donated to me his first watch ever, please see details below:
    engraved on the back
    CITIZEN WATCH CO. WATHER RESISTANT
    ALL STAINLESS STEEL
    4-211227 TA
    0020887
    44-8290
    Gn-7w-u
    Japan

    I had a look on your blog and I asked uncle google, but I cannot find any info about this watch.
    The first 4 digits of the case number suggest is a 21xx series movement but engraved on the actual movement says 1200B which doesn’t come up anywhere. I asked citizen uk and they cannot find this watch, they said it’s too old. The first 00 on the case number make me think is either from 1970 or 1980 but according to my father it’s definitely earlier then 1980.

    Could you please help me in finding more info about the watch but more in particular the movement?

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Alessio, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comments – much appreciated. Interesting to see that you didn’t get information from Citizen, although not surprising – I have had the same experience – it was the lack of historical reference material on the internet that led me to set about my research and then publish this blog. So here is what I can say about your father’s watch based on all the helpful info you have provided. Firstly, the watch is a quartz model with the 1200B movement inside, as you have discovered. This is a fairy early quartz movement, although not one of the very early ones. Quartz technology was first seen in Citizen’s line-up in 1974, still driving a hairspring in the first model. That was soon replaced by a ‘stepping motor’ design and the first generation of those appeared in the later 1970s, although the new technology meant they were very expensive. As the technology was developed and mass production increased more and more models became available, with a subsequent drop in prices. Your watch fits in between these two positions (i.e still fairly expensive!), since I believe it was made in February 1980 – this is derived from the first three figures in the serial number. The 1200B movement was not made in 1979 (I have checked that in my reference material), and I suspect it had only a short production run since so little information is available and it seems to be a rather rare thing as a result. Although serial numbers don’t tell us what decade a watch was made in, given quartz watches were not made in 1970 and your father’s recollections of its age, this seems the correct date to me.

      Unfortunately, Citizen’s practice of using case numbers that helped to identify the movement was not maintained, so ‘4-211227′ doesn’t help with that. However, I know 4-211xxx numbers and ’44’ model numbers were both used on the 1200B models.

      I can usually find a technical manual for Citizen’s quartz movements, but I’m afraid not for this one. This adds weight to my conclusion that the 1200B was something of a transitional movement that was not produced for very long.

      I hope this helps, Stephen

      • Alessio says:

        Hello Stephen,

        Thanks a lot, this really helps.
        Is the movement a variant of a 1200 and the B defines the movement variant or it’s a stand alone movement? Uncle google also believe that this movement has been superseded by the 7991. Does it ring any bell to you?
        Would you be able to tell in what other watches this movement has been used?
        I’m trying to understand if i can find donor watches.
        The watch is working fine at the moment but it had a battery leak which has corroded around the battery and the watchmaker wasn’t able to quantify the damage.
        I have been told that it is better not service this watch at all due to its age. Do you agree?

        Thanks
        Alessio

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Alessio, you’re welcome 🙂 I don’t know if there was a 1200’A’ – I can’t find any reference to it so maybe not. It’s possible that the 7991 movement replaced it, that was around in the mid to late 1980s I think, and discontinued around 1990 but I don’t have reference material for this later period. I can’t advise on whether to service it (I’m not a watch techie) although I suppose the adage ‘if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it’ may apply. A donor watch is the most likely source of parts or a full movement. However, here is the only example I’ve been able to find so far, from a post over 5 years ago: http://www.thewatchsite.com/21-japanese-watch-discussion-forum/16574-id-please-identify-citizen-quartz.html

          Besides searching eBay, the other place you could try is Yahoo Japan (http://auctions.search.yahoo.co.jp/search?rkf=2&p=citizen+quartz&aucmaxprice=999999999&thumb=1&s1=score2&o1=a&ei=utf-8). Type Citizen Quartz or Citizen CQ in the search box and see what comes up. I saw one model 4-212xxx which could be the no day/date version of the 1200. If you are patient then regular searches of YJ might eventually come up with a suitable donor. Unfortunately Japanese sellers rarely show movement pictures so you have to be sure that it is right from the description / external pics. It’s fairly easy to buy from YJ, but you have to go through a proxy service such as Buyee. Let me know if you want more info on how to do that.
          Stephen

  111. DIRK VAN DER WEERT says:

    Hi i’m from Belgium my name is Dirk i have 3 citizen bullheads and i’m looking for original parts who can help me wfr

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Dirk, thanks for visiting my blog. Hard to find original 8110 parts these days, so usually donor watches/movements or used parts have to be used. Can sometimes be found on eBay (search for Citizen 8110a should work), and ‘Speedtimerkollection’ in Spain often has bits and pieces. Of course the problem with used parts is that their condition may not be good or unclear. If you know what you are looking for, a search using the specific part number might find something.
      Stephen

  112. DIRK VAN DER WEERT says:

    Hi i’m back merry christmas. i just buying a octagone do you know somebody who can do a little restauration

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Dirk – Happy Christmas. I can recommend Brian Leiser, who has serviced a number of my watches. He’s in the USA – let me know if you want me to send you his email address. Stephen

      • Dirk says:

        Yes please if you want to is it expensive for restauration .Dirk

        Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone

        >

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Dirk – good quality servicing and restoration is quite expensive. I’m sure Brian will give you an idea of the potential cost. Email on the way with his contact details. Stephen

  113. Mate Skoda says:

    HI,
    I would like to know something more about this watch.
    Can u help me please.
    (http://www.njuskalo.hr/muski-satovi/citizen-17-jewels-nato-mint-stanje-oglas-5690193)

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Mate, thank you for visiting my blog. The watch in the link is a hand-winder with a Homer (02) movement inside, made for export since it has no model name on the dial and is marked ‘water protected’ / ‘unbreakable spring’ rather than ‘parawater’. The case back markings confirm the movement used, 63-XXXX model numbers and 4-02xxxx case numbers are typical of the Homer models. The serial number looks to start with 103xxxxx so it was made in March 1971. The style of the case back and the numbering are correct for the late 1960s/early 1970s. The 02 movement was first produced in 1960 and continued in production for over 20 years. More info here:
      Stephen

  114. Greg says:

    Thanks for this fantastic blog! I’ve just been given a Citizen Parawater Automatic, 4-540085 Y, 90711563. Can you give me any info on this 17-Jewel gem?

    Cheers,
    -Greg in Raleigh, NC

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Greg, thanks for visiting my blog and for your kind comment. Can you please confirm that you have one of these:

      (with acknowledgement for this image to the seller)
      Sometimes incorrect case backs have been used, so I thought I’d check first before going into any detail about it 🙂

      Stephen

      • Greg says:

        Hi Stephen – That looks exactly like mine.

        • sweephand says:

          Hi Greg – thanks for confirming this is the one 🙂 What you have is a diver style sports model that was sometimes carried the ‘Compact’ model logo for the Japanese market. They are fairly rare, especially in good condition. They are not depth rated so are not ‘true’ divers, so I have not included it on the diver reference page, but they do look nice 🙂 The automatic movement is the 5400 with 17 jewels, the day only version of the better known 5200 series which was used in the Crystal Seven range. These movements were first produced in 1965, and were Citizen’s most successful watches at that time once they phased out the ‘Jet’ automatics in favour of the more conventional swinging weight auto winding mechanism. This design of movement was adopted to allow thinner models, which became the fashion and which the thicker ‘Jet’ could not support. It runs at 18,000 beats per hour, which was the norm for the majority of watches at the time. The 5200 movement came in many models and with varied jewel counts right up to 43! The 5400 was not used quite as much, but nevertheless had jewel counts of 17, 21, 27, 33 and 35. The 33 and 35 jewel movements were used in the high end ‘Chrono Master’ range – indicating that this movement is capable of very good performance.

          Your example is case number 4-540085, which clearly indicates the 54 movement inside. There’s no separate model number. Finally the first three figures in the serial number gives a production date of July 1969.
          Stephen

          • Greg says:

            WOW! This is fantastically detailed and hugely appreciated. Turns out the watch was made around my first birthday! I loved the watch before, but this makes it super special.

  115. citizendiver says:

    hi Stephen
    I´m sorry if this is my second post about the same issue but i xN´T FIND THE ORIGINAL
    I have a women divers citizen, about 33mm, i think around 1980 model, in quite good shape
    It has the following numbers in the car GN 4 S, and 54-0919 among other numbers.
    I´m looking if possible for the original rubber band and an idea of it´s value
    can you help me ?
    best regards and thanks in advance

  116. Juan says:

    Hi,
    So sorry to ask….but I am afraid I have not find out an answer to this question before
    Which glass/crystal number should fit in a Citizen Seven Star Parawater APSS-2812-Y?
    Thanks in advance

  117. Claude says:

    Hi, awesome Citizen reference page! a true gem for citizen fans!
    I was recently sold an “alleged” caliber 52-0110 vintage diver, and having never owned one, I bought it a decent price. However, after doing some googling, i see that i cannot at all see this versiob of 150m diver anywheree in the net, making me afraid this is a frankenwatch. All samples of 52-0110 have square markers and mercedes hands while this has round markers and differene hands.I hope Im wrong, but here are pics of the vintage 150m citizen I bought, hope you can help me identify it, or determine if this is indeed a franken. Thanks!!

    • sweephand says:

      Hi Claude, thanks for visiting my blog, and for your kind comment. I’m afraid that your watch is something of a franken. As you have suspected, it looks like the original 52-0110 dial has been replaced by a later version, from the 1980s. This later one still used the 8200 automatic movement, and was rated to 150m so maybe the original movement and dial were in poor condition but the case was rescued and re-furbished.
      Stephen

  118. tardima says:

    Dear Stephen, I could provide you with the nice photos of (almost mint) blue-dialed 67-5776 (dec.1970, made for and sold on German market) for your beautiful mechanical diver reference gallery, if you’re interested. I could also share with the community one interesting finding I made on the silicone strap with curved ends fitting this 67-5776 case perfectly, giving it fantastic smart and contemporary, almost premium look. I don’t want to spam the comments- so I’m asking. Thank you.

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